From:      skunk-works-digest-owner@harbor.ecn.purdue.edu
To:        skunk-works-digest@harbor.ecn.purdue.edu
Subject:   Skunk Works Digest V4 #56
Reply-To:  skunk-works-digest@harbor.ecn.purdue.edu
Errors-To: skunk-works-digest-owner@harbor.ecn.purdue.edu
Precedence: bulk

Skunk Works Digest       Saturday, 6 November 1993     Volume 04 : Number 056

In this issue:

	only a small test
	Secrecy Oversight Council
	Secrecy Oversight Council address
	New AURORA model HIT of Chicago Toy Show This Week!
	Non-existent plane makes national radio news
	Re: New AURORA model HIT of Chicago Toy Show This Week!
	Article in Salt Lake Tribune about 4,000 acre land grab @ Groom Lake
	Groom Lake pic
	Re: Article in Salt Lake Tribune about 4,000 acre land grab @ Groom Lake 
	Re: Not much going on in the list.

See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the skunk-works
or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: sp2stes1@ida.his.se (Stefan "Stetson" Skoglund)
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 93 10:17:10 +0100
Subject: only a small test

Only a small test.

Very little activity on the list...

- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Stefan 'Stetson' Skoglund       I    "Viggen     |     i tiden *)"
sp2stes1@ida.his.se             I                |
University of Skoevde, Sweden   I          _____/0\_____
- --------------------------------I  ____________O(.)O___________
                                I        -+-     O     -+-
                                I *) Viggen with two Rb04


------------------------------

From: Michael Matthew Guslick <michaelg@csd4.csd.uwm.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1993 09:36:41 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Secrecy Oversight Council

Hi, all.

     The Secrecy Oversight Council's new catalog is out.  If anyone doesn't
know what the SOC is, here's what the catalog says:

"Secrecy Oversight Council is a private research and publishing company
promoting openness and reasonable public oversight in government.  Curently,
we are specializing in Federal land use and rumored military projects in
Southern Nevada.  Although we are a taxable entity, profit is not our goal.
Our prices are intended only to reimburse our costs and support our
continued research."

The catalog isn't extensive, but the stuff in it is neat.  An Area 51
Viewer's Guide, USGS Maps, Newsclipping portfolios, an upcoming patch for
Groom Lake, Bill Sweetman's new book _Aurora_, and of course, Jim Goodall's
Photomural of Groom.

As someone else just said, there's not a lot of activity on the list
lately.  Maybe this will help.

- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Guslick                    /    ^    \                  USnail: 711 Hwy. C
NAR #53962                 ---(.)==<-.->==(.)---              Grafton, WI 53024
michaelg@csd4.csd.uwm.edu     SR-71 Blackbird               ph.: (414) 377-4428
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            LIBERATE GROOM LAKE

------------------------------

From: Michael Matthew Guslick <michaelg@csd4.csd.uwm.edu>
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1993 11:28:15 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Secrecy Oversight Council address

<<<from Mike Henderson>>>
Greetings

The SOC catalog sounds great.  Could you post an address or phone
number through which it can be acquired?  I'm sure posting it to
Skunkworks would please many.

M. Henderson(mike@blitzen.gvg.tek.com)
<<<end quote>>>

Sorry about that!  Here's the address fo the SOC  (Glenn Campbell, director)

Secrecy Oversight Council
HCR Box 38
Rachel, NV  89001


I'm sending in my order today!

- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mike Guslick                    /    ^    \                  USnail: 711 Hwy. C
NAR #53962                 ---(.)==<-.->==(.)---              Grafton, WI 53024
michaelg@csd4.csd.uwm.edu     SR-71 Blackbird               ph.: (414) 377-4428
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            LIBERATE GROOM LAKE


------------------------------

From: larry@ichips.intel.com
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1993 10:11:04 -0800
Subject: New AURORA model HIT of Chicago Toy Show This Week!

The Testors AURORA model is out I guess.

Yesterday Phil caught the tail end of a radio interview with John Andrews,
the chief aircraft model designer at Testors. This interview was evidently
on NPR via his local NPR affiliate in Lafayette IND, at around noon. I
listened around noon out here in OR to my local NPR affiliate, but no joy.

Anyway, I was pleasantly surprised to find coverage of the Chicago Toy
Show at the end of the 11 O'clock news on our local ABC affiliate last
night. The big announcement was the new Testors AURORA models. They teased
the audience with some video of them before going to a final commercial,
which gave me time to fire up my VCR. These models are quite nice looking!

They showed all three nicely built-up models in color. The XR-7, the
XR-7 + SR-75, and the in flight SR-75 model that's been out for a few months
now. Definitely a high neat-looking coefficient!

They mentioned that Testors had correctly predicted the existence and 
certain attributes of the Stealth Fighter and now they were predicting the
existence of this aircraft (they didn't mention that Testors also correctly
predicted the shape of the U-2 back long ago - in fact Kelly Johnson asked
them to hold off production of the model which they did until Gary Powers
was shot down). They mentioned the Pentagon said such a thing (the AURORA)
doesn't exist but they indicated that they said that last time as well.
They also indicated that it was amusing that a toy company should have such
a good record predicting super secret spy planes!

One thing that should prove interesting is analyzing the XR-7 design for
it's hypersonic correctness (at M < 10 say) as well as its low speed for
landing properties. Perhaps after those of us that are interested can get our
hands on these things we can discuss this. Maybe Charles (you know who
you are) can get the hypersonic design goup he's involved with to give
us their opinion as well! Maybe some of the other guys on this list
who are involved with hypersonics (you know who you are) can give us their
impressions as well.

One area I've personally started with is comparing the XR-7 design
with a known Mach 6+ actual design (like maybe the X-15A-2) and
the lessons learned from flying such a design at Mach 6+.

Larry


------------------------------

From: "JOE P." <PYRDEK@vax.edinboro.edu>
Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1993 14:00:41 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Non-existent plane makes national radio news

<From: larry@ichips.intel.com
<Subject: New AURORA model HIT of Chicago Toy Show This Week!
Quoted (partial) article
========================================================================

The Testors AURORA model is out I guess.

Yesterday Phil caught the tail end of a radio interview with John Andrews,
the chief aircraft model designer at Testors. This interview was evidently
on NPR via his local NPR affiliate in Lafayette IND, at around noon. I
listened around noon out here in OR to my local NPR affiliate, but no joy.

[text deleted]


They mentioned that Testors had correctly predicted the existence and 
certain attributes of the Stealth Fighter and now they were predicting the
existence of this aircraft (they didn't mention that Testors also correctly
predicted the shape of the U-2 back long ago - in fact Kelly Johnson asked
them to hold off production of the model which they did until Gary Powers
was shot down). They mentioned the Pentagon said such a thing (the AURORA)
doesn't exist but they indicated that they said that last time as well.
They also indicated that it was amusing that a toy company should have such
a good record predicting super secret spy planes!

[text deleted]

Larry
==========================================================================
End Quoted Article

Paul Harvey also had mention of the SR 7 (the seven was supposed to
signify Mach 7) on thursday's broadcast.

He also made light of Testors sucess in guessing (????) the close
to actual shape of aircraft that, according to government sources,
don't exist such as Stalth Fighter.

He also made mention of the National Reconisance Office and pointed
out that untill very recently, the existance of this office was
denied.

Does anyone see the veil getting just a bit thinner in spots?????

Who knows, we might actaully get to see the vaporware plane yet.

From the hallowed halls of Edinboro University- (814) 732-2484
and direct from the terminal of,              - 142 Miller Bldg.
                                              - Edinboro Univ.
Joe Pyrdek   pyrdek@edinboro.edu              - Edinboro PA 16444

------------------------------

From: larry@ichips.intel.com
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1993 11:09:07 -0800
Subject: Re: New AURORA model HIT of Chicago Toy Show This Week!

Well it looks as though the USAF has provided John Andrews
with what he needs to push the AURORA models!! I think the
announced and verified USAF land grab in the Groom Lake area
is playing directly into his hands!

I might also direct a few people to watch their TV's tonight
and this weekend for additional information. This new model
of Testors has caused quite a stir!

Evidently Bill Sweetman has been interviewed for airing on at
least ABC and Bill Scott of AW&ST (who broke the story on the
big XB-70 like aircraft) was interviewed for 15 minutes yesterday
for what he was promised was a Peter Jennings (ABC) segment
tonight or this weekend (however, Mr. Scott was later told it
would only air in Chicago where the Toy Show was going on).
Mr. Scott was also interviewed on radio (on-air) in Dallas
yesterday and evidently CBS is putting something together
as we speak right now (they want the doghnuts-on-a-rope
shots). There is also a another outfit that is working this story
right now (he's not sure who they are yet). So I guess be
prepared to watch for something tonight/this weekend, but
also don't be disappointed if you get nothing.

Larry

------------------------------

From: Rich Thomson <rthomson@dsd.es.com>
Date: Fri, 05 Nov 93 12:45:14 MST
Subject: Article in Salt Lake Tribune about 4,000 acre land grab @ Groom Lake

I just heard of and subscribed to this list, but I posted the
newspaper article mentioned in the Subject: to rec.aviation.military.
If you don't read that group, or missed the article and want to read
it, just let me know and I can either repost it to this list or send
it to you individually.

Also, I scanned the accompanying photo that went with the article (the
first photo I've ever scene in the press that actually showed the base
at Groom Lake) and placed it in the FTP area.  I have notified the
maintainer of the area so that he can move it to the pics directory.
If you can't wait that long, you might want to check
alt.binaries.pictures.misc where I just posted it as well.  Further,
if you can't do either FTP or Usenet, I can e-mail you a copy of the
picture (its 3 messages in JPEG format).

GroomLake.jpg		130281		1500x655		(Color)

						-- Rich
- --
         Between stimulus and response is the will to choose.
  ------------------------------------------------------------------
         IRC: _Rich_                            Rich Thomson
        Internet: rthomson@dsd.es.com           Fractal Freak

------------------------------

From: "Philip R. Moyer" <prm@ecn.purdue.edu>
Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1993 14:44:07 EST
Subject: Groom Lake pic

The picture Rich mentioned in the previous mail is in
/pub/skunk-works/pic/A51/GroomLake.jpg on harbor.ecn.purdue.edu.

Philip R. Moyer                                       Bits: prm@ecn.purdue.edu
Engineering Computer Network                          Voice:      317-494-3648
Unix Operating Systems Group                          Fax:        317-494-6440

------------------------------

From: Rich Thomson <rthomson@dsd.es.com>
Date: Fri, 05 Nov 93 14:24:55 MST
Subject: Re: Article in Salt Lake Tribune about 4,000 acre land grab @ Groom Lake 

In message <9311051945.AA05671@mesa.dsd.ES.COM> 
    Rich Thomson <rthomson@dsd.ES.COM> writes:
> Also, I scanned the accompanying photo that went with the article (the
> first photo I've ever scene in the press that actually showed the base
> at Groom Lake) and placed it in the FTP area.

Just thought that I should mention that this is not a scan of the
printed newspaper.  I bought a print of the photo from the paper and
scanned the print directly.  You can make out individual buildings,
roads, etc.
						-- Rich
- --
         Between stimulus and response is the will to choose.
  ------------------------------------------------------------------
         IRC: _Rich_                            Rich Thomson
        Internet: rthomson@dsd.es.com           Fractal Freak

------------------------------

From: larry@ichips.intel.com
Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1993 14:44:32 -0800
Subject: Re: Not much going on in the list.

There is actually more that can be discussed.

In the latest issue of Intercepts, that many people received this week,
Steve Douglass published a frame from a video that he believes is of
the TR-3A. This video was taken near Roswell Airfield in New Mexico
during war games earlier this year. The video shows a front profile of
an aircraft that shows no detail, but its shape is very similar to a B-2.
When the aircraft turned its planform didn't match the B-2's planform.

Also there is an account of an aircraft that landed at White Sands
with tail no. 803 that was referred to as the STF by the security and
maintenance channels at that airbase. Later that same day there was
a showing of that aircraft for the security people at that base and then
for someone named "The Chief". The roads in the area of White Sands
were closed down during this 'showing' (this is done frequently at WSMR
during launches as well).

There is also a column by Glen Campbell of "Area 51 Viewers Guide" fame as
well in this issue. Nothing new to report except that there is a map of 
where Freedom Ridge is, as well as other sites (only the ones to the east
of Groom seem to be shown on this map). The map is a repro of the actual
USAF map used to request more land from the BLM. Maybe the USAF didn't try
to lock away the northern sites under the Groom runway!

We're trying to get Steve Douglass himself, now that he has Net access,
to post a summary of the first two subjects himself. If we can't get that,
then someone else will post a more detailed summary of both incidents.

Larry

------------------------------

End of Skunk Works Digest V4 #56
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