From: skunk-works-digest-owner@mail.orst.edu To: skunk-works-digest@mail.orst.edu Subject: Skunk Works Digest V5 #189 Reply-To: skunk-works-digest@mail.orst.edu Errors-To: skunk-works-digest-owner@mail.orst.edu Precedence: bulk Skunk Works Digest Thursday, 26 January 1995 Volume 05 : Number 189 In this issue: Reworked U-2,s Re: USAF SR-71 AW&ST Jan. 23, 1995 SR-71 restarts... Re: SR-71 restarts... TR-3A sighting ? Re: USAF SR-71 Re: starts, restarts Re: SR71 starts Re: USAF SR-71 flash-boom ? SR-71 unstarts Fuel dumping and the SR Re: USAF SR-71 TR-3A TR-3A sighting ? See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the skunk-works or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: JOHN Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 09:20:34 EST Subject: Reworked U-2,s 3 newly modified U-2 aircraft were delivered to the 9th SRW at Beale on Oct 28th. according to AIR FORCE magazine, they had received new, uprated GE engines. the models reportedly are 2 U-2ST trainers and a U-2S for operations. Air Force Magazine Jan 1995 pp20 The same issue has a story on project "Black Shield" , the use of A-12 's to overfly Vietnam in the 60's. accord to the sidebar it is information condensed from the "OXCART" study written by "Thomas P. McIninch" I hav,nt pulled up the OXCART issue from the archive to see how close it fits. John Szalay Louisville, Ky jpszalay@tacl.dnet.ge.com DISCLAIMER: GE & I rarely see eye to eye on anything. So why should I attempt to speak for them ! ------------------------------ From: Adrian Thurlow Date: Wed, 25 Jan 95 15:33:13 +0000 Subject: Re: USAF SR-71 Dean Adams writes: >Blackbird to rejoin Air Force by MSgt. Louis A. Arana-Barradas Air Force News Service Stuff deleted >By Sept. 1, two A-model jets and one B-model pilot trainer are scheduled to become operational, said Maj. Brian Bergdahl, the Air Force SR-71 program manager. Stuff deleted >It's that office's job to get the aircraft -- the other two are in storage at Lockheed's Palmdale plant -- outfitted and flying again. I believe that this could be incorrect or some stuff is missing. If an A model has been delivered surely the B model will be that at NASA already and only one A model will come from store. Unless the A model delivered is to be returned to NASA as Mary suggested could be the case. Regards Regards Adrian Thurlow / Det.4 9th SRW \ Technology Integration / \ BT Labs / _ \ Martlesham Heath ____(( ))_________/_/_\_\_________(( ))____ Ipswich \ \_/ / Suffolk U.K. Now only distant thunder Tel. +44 1473 644880 Fax. +44 1473 646534 e-mail. Adrian.Thurlow@bt-sys.bt.co.uk The views expressed above are not necessarily those of BT. ------------------------------ From: Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 17:03:26 -0500 (EST) Subject: AW&ST Jan. 23, 1995 The latest AW&ST has some news about the crashed X-31, the soon to be completed Strato 2C and two JAST/stealth related article. Quoted and summarized without permission: NEWS BREAKS: "THE NO.1 MULTINATIONAL X-31 testbed aircraft crashed in a sparsely populated area north of Edwards AFB, Calif., on Jan. 19 during a research flight. Karl Lang, a German test pilot, ejected safely. NASA officials said the aircraft was en route to the base after completing planned tests on the third flight of the day. Two X-31 aircraft built by Rockwell and Deutsche Aerospace have been conducting research flights at NASA/Dryden under a joint program overseen by the U.S. Advanced Research Projects Agency." That would mean, that BuAerNo 164584, the "better" one, crashed. "GROB STRATO-2C AIRFRAME NEARS COMPLETION All composite airframe for the Grob Strato-2C long-endurance aircraft nears completion at the company's plant near Munich. The 185-ft.-wingspan aircraft was funded by the German Ministry of Research and Technology. It will offer its four-man crew a shirt-sleeve environment for extended observations, for example, to help predict the effects of high-speed transport aircraft on the upper atmosphere or to better understand polar and tropical weather processes. It will be powered by a Teledyne Continental IO-550 piston engine in combi- nation with a hybrid three-stage supercharger. The aircraft is expected to offer 8 hr. of flight at 80,000 ft., 48 hr. at 60,000 ft. or 80 hr. at 40,000 ft. Each engine will operate at 400 shp. continuously to drive a 20 ft. dia. pusher propeller at 650 rpm. The aircraft is expected to cruise at 107 kt. with up to 1,800-lb. payloads." A picture of the airframe, with tail and wings mounted, but without engines is included. Contrary to what I previously wrote in "German High-Flying Plan(e)s", the final design seems to be the one with pusher-propeller and T-tail. Interestingly, the _Flug Revue_ from Jan. 1993 has an artists impression and a three-side drawing of the Strato 2C in this configuration, but the _Flug Revue_ from Oct. 1994 shows a similar drawing with the aircraft having puller-propeller and a low tail-unit. Go figure... On page 34, 38 and 39 are two articles about JAST (and ex-CALF) and stealth, including artists impressions of Lockheed's, Boeing's and McDonnell Douglas' (teamed with Northrop-Grumman and BAe) concepts. They also talk about related contracts for research on avionics, RCS, antennas, software and airframe structures. The second article focuses on the McDonnell Douglas studies. It also mentions -- for the first time, as far as I know -- the "Have Slick" air-to-ground stand-off missile project, another stealthy counterpart to the also stealthy "Have Dash" air-to-air missile project. - -- Andreas - --- --- Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl Absolute Software 313 West Court St. #305 schnars@umcc.ais.org Flint, MI 48502-1239 Tel: (810) 238-8469 - --- --- ------------------------------ From: Corey Lawson Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 18:00:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: SR-71 restarts... What about that picture in AirInternational? a few years ago of an SR-71 doing a flyby at an air show in Europe, as I recall... Sorry about the lack of more specifics. They throttled up an engine to Afterburner, which of course, dumped a huge cloud of unburned fuel out the tailpipe, and then the 'burner lit up, also igniting the unburnt fuel already expelled. Picture captured the huge fireball that resulted... Can't remember if there was a corresponding BOOM! mentioned in the article... - -Corey Lawson csl@booster.u.washington.edu ------------------------------ From: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk (John Burtenshaw) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 09:57:49 +0000 Subject: Re: SR-71 restarts... >What about that picture in AirInternational? a few years ago of an SR-71 >doing a flyby at an air show in Europe, as I recall... Sorry about the >lack of more specifics. > >They throttled up an engine to Afterburner, which of course, dumped a >huge cloud of unburned fuel out the tailpipe, and then the 'burner lit >up, also igniting the unburnt fuel already expelled. Picture captured >the huge fireball that resulted... Can't remember if there was a >corresponding BOOM! mentioned in the article... It was the Mildenhall Airshow. It was televised by the BBC and the resulting pictures were AMAZING!! Can't remember a boom though.... Cheers John ============================================================================= John Burtenshaw BOURNEMOUTH System Administrator, The Computer Centre UNIVERSITY - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -Postal Address: Talbot Campus, Fern Barrow, POOLE, Dorset, BH12 5BB Internet: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk Phone: 01202 595089 Fax: 01202 513293 Packet Radio: G1HOK @ GB7BNM.#45.GBR.EU AMPRnet: G1HOK.ampr.org. [44.131.17.82] Compuserve: 10033,3113 ============================================================================= ------------------------------ From: "J. Pharabod" Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 10:52:13 MET Subject: TR-3A sighting ? Something which looks like a nice sighting of the TR-3A is reported in the Groom Lake Desert Rat # 21. Since Glenn Campbell says that his electronic journal should be reposted entirely, not fragmented, and since my English/American is so bad that it would be tiring to paraphrase, I suggest that you find this issue of the Desert Rat on the net. A short summary however: the sighting occurred on November 23, 35 miles east of Groom. The witness is said to be an experienced aviation watcher. He saw 4 F-117A + 4 triangular crafts with rounded corners, which were not B-2. J. Pharabod ------------------------------ From: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk (John Burtenshaw) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 09:39:47 +0000 Subject: Re: USAF SR-71 > > > >Blackbird to rejoin Air Force >by MSgt. Louis A. Arana-Barradas >Air Force News Service > > WASHINGTON -- The first of three SR-71 Blackbird >reconnaissance jets flew into Palmdale, Calif., Jan. 12 for a >complete overhaul and refitting before rejoining the Air Force. > The NASA-flown and operated A-model jet was delivered to >the Lockheed Aircraft Corp. plant where it will be restored to >operational status. > By Sept. 1, two A-model jets and one B-model pilot trainer are >scheduled to become operational, said Maj. Brian Bergdahl, the >Air Force SR-71 program manager. > Congress appropriated $100 million in the fiscal year 1995 >defense budget to reactivate the aircraft. Where the high-speed >aircraft will be based has not yet been determined, but they will be >operated by Air Combat Command, Bergdahl said. Flight International reported last week that the SR-71's will be based at Edwards AFB and possibly Beale AFB - the last seems more realistic due to its past connections with the 'bird. John ============================================================================= John Burtenshaw BOURNEMOUTH System Administrator, The Computer Centre UNIVERSITY - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- - -Postal Address: Talbot Campus, Fern Barrow, POOLE, Dorset, BH12 5BB Internet: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk Phone: 01202 595089 Fax: 01202 513293 Packet Radio: G1HOK @ GB7BNM.#45.GBR.EU AMPRnet: G1HOK.ampr.org. [44.131.17.82] Compuserve: 10033,3113 ============================================================================= ------------------------------ From: soundy@sybase.com (Richard Soundy) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 10:49:51 Subject: Re: starts, restarts Ok, Lurk mode I am a little confused (this *is* a normal state of affairs). Concerning the SR-71 engines. I understand the theory (?) regarding an "unstart" of the engine, but (and here comes question 1) does the engine ever "flame out", and is this as much of a problem as it can be on a civilian jet? And question 2 - after following skunk works for some time (lurking in the back) I seem to recall that when the engine unstarts all thrust is lost from that engine. Does this not cause all sorts of problems when travelling at the higher mach numbers. Regards Richard Soundy Lurk Mode ------------------------------ From: Adrian Thurlow Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 11:02:29 +0000 Subject: Re: SR71 starts Hi Skunkers, Corey Lawson writes: >What about that picture in AirInternational? a few years ago of an SR-71 doing a flyby at an air show in Europe, as I recall... Sorry about the lack of more specifics. They throttled up an engine to Afterburner, which of course, dumped a huge cloud of unburned fuel out the tailpipe, and then the 'burner lit up, also igniting the unburnt fuel already expelled. Picture captured the huge fireball that resulted... Can't remember if there was a corresponding BOOM! mentioned in the article...< This probably refers to the Mildenhall AirFete 1987 (I think?) I was there and it was a very spectacular sight. The official explanation was that there was a fault in the afterburner section of the offending engine (it only occurred on one side). This is not normally a characteristic of the SR71, when lighting the 'burners on take off a large explosion is not seen. Well I've never seen one. As to the explosion of the fuel I can only describe the sound as a "whomp". It was not particularly loud, certainly not louder than the noise generated by the aircraft in flight with burners. I have heard louder pyrotechnics. I cannot see it as an explanation for booms. Regards Adrian Thurlow / Det.4 9th SRW \ Technology Integration / \ BT Labs / _ \ Martlesham Heath ____(( ))_________/_/_\_\_________(( ))____ Ipswich \ \_/ / Suffolk U.K. Now only distant thunder Tel. +44 1473 644880 Fax. +44 1473 646534 e-mail. Adrian.Thurlow@bt-sys.bt.co.uk The views expressed above are not necessarily those of BT. ------------------------------ From: jstone@iglou.com (John Stone) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 08:04 EST Subject: Re: USAF SR-71 To: skunk-works-digest@gaia.ucs.orst.edu Subject: Re: USAF SR-71 >From: Adrian Thurlow A>Dean Adams writes: A>Stuff deleted A>>By Sept. 1, two A-model jets and one B-model pilot trainer are >scheduled to become operational, said Maj. Brian Bergdahl, the >Air Force SR-71 program manager. A>I believe that this could be incorrect or some stuff is missing. If an A >model has been delivered surely the B model will be that at NASA already and >only one A model will come from store. Unless the A model delivered is to be >returned to NASA as Mary suggested could be the case. As I understand from conversing with some ex-SR crew members that have been helping the with the reactivation of the SR. (Mary, please correct if wrong) that the NASA SR #832(#971) will be used until the 2 of 3 the SRs in storage have been checked out, then #832 will be returned to NASA. But the B(trainer; NASA #831; USAF #956) model will be shared between NASA and USAF. Please correct me if I'm incorrect on this... John Stone - --- þ QMPro 1.52 þ I never met a Blackbird I didn't like...... ------------------------------ From: JOHN Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 08:55:47 EST Subject: flash-boom ? > What about that picture in AirInternational? a few years ago of an SR-71 > doing a flyby at an air show in Europe, as I recall... Sorry about the > lack of more specifics. > > They throttled up an engine to Afterburner, which of course, dumped a > huge cloud of unburned fuel out the tailpipe, and then the 'burner lit > up, also igniting the unburnt fuel already expelled. Picture captured > the huge fireball that resulted... Can't remember if there was a > corresponding BOOM! mentioned in the article... > > -Corey Lawson > csl@booster.u.washington.edu ..................... I,m far from an expert on this, however, again from Ben Rich's Book, In several of the passages written by SR-71 drivers, they make references it being a standard practice, for the driver to dump fuel and ignite it to create a large flare in the exhaust, there is one passage in which one pilot, on hearing another on the radio below his altitude, to stage a fuel dump so that he could see where he was. John Szalay jpszalay@tacl.dnet.ge.com Standard Disclaimers apply ? ------------------------------ From: ron@habu.stortek.com (Ron Schweikert) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 08:24:53 MST Subject: SR-71 unstarts >I am a little confused (this *is* a normal state of affairs). Concerning the >SR-71 engines. I understand the theory (?) regarding an "unstart" of the >engine, but (and here comes question 1) does the engine ever "flame out", >and is this as much of a problem as it can be on a civilian jet? The engines can flame out, but the plane flies just fine on one (albeit on a bee-line for the nearest recovery base). >And question 2 - after following skunk works for some time (lurking in the >back) I seem to recall that when the engine unstarts all thrust is lost >from that engine. Does this not cause all sorts of problems when travelling >at the higher mach numbers. > >Regards Richard Soundy I'll defer the "full" answer to experts, but my understanding is that the engine is still producing full thrust duing an unstart. What happens during normal operation is that a shock wave is attached to the front of the spike. As the speed increases, the shock wave "bends" further and further back. At M1.4, it goes inside the inlet. At this point the spike's computer carefully positions the shock wave into a small area called the "shock trap" which is a 5/8" wide opening in the inner part of the nacelle. Since the J58 can handle only subsonic air, this positioning is critical. As the supersonic air passes through the shock wave, it becomes subsonic (well, okay, something like that). The rest of the air bypasses the engine and is re-introduced into the tailpipe. Anyway, if the spike blows it, the shock wave can be lost. This causes a very large and sudden yaw action as one engine, while producing full thrust, isn't augmented by the shock wave, but also aerodynamically the plane is altered. If it weren't for an on-board computer that reacts faster than the pilot can that slams the rudders to whatever degree is necessary, the plane would no doubt be lost. The yaw is so sudden that it can, and has, broken the pilot's helmet as it got slammed to the side. The computer, after sensing the "unstart," slams the spike fully forward (it retracts up to 22" into the nacelle during max cruise) and then retracts it to recapture and reposition the shock wave properly. Hope this helps. Regards -- Ron ------------------------------ From: ron@habu.stortek.com (Ron Schweikert) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 08:31:34 MST Subject: Fuel dumping and the SR >I,m far from an expert on this, however, again from Ben Rich's Book, > >In several of the passages written by SR-71 drivers, they make references >it being a standard practice, for the driver to dump fuel and ignite it >to create a large flare in the exhaust, there is one passage in which >one pilot, on hearing another on the radio below his altitude, to stage >a fuel dump so that he could see where he was. > > > John Szalay > jpszalay@tacl.dnet.ge.com > >Standard Disclaimers apply ? I won't dispute it as I guess it could burn, but having seen many, many launches first-hand, when the aircraft starts its roll, it's not unusual to have some fuel spill out the back. The pilot hits burners and all you hear is the regular boom -- I never saw the extra fuel ignite (even at night). The Farnborough thing must've been a fluke, but what a sight! As far as dumping at altitude, my understanding was that the sight it made was from vaporization, not burning. I honestly can't see any pilot purposely dumping fuel with the expressed purpose of having it ignite. Yikes!!!! At Kadena once we had a pilot call in and he was going to do a high-speed, high-altitude flyby (72K ft, at 3.2). Naturally we wouldn't be able to see him with our naked eye. At the appointed time, we suddenly saw three long, FAST streaks appear in the sky. The pilot said he'd hit the fuel dump switch three times for less than one second each. Very impressive. Cheers! Ron ------------------------------ From: hendefd@mail.auburn.edu Date: Thu, 26 Jan 1995 10:07:57 +0600 Subject: Re: USAF SR-71 > As I understand from conversing with some ex-SR crew members that have > been helping the with the reactivation of the SR. (Mary, please correct > if wrong) that the NASA SR #832(#971) will be used until the 2 of 3 the > SRs in storage have been checked out, then #832 will be returned to > NASA. But the B(trainer; NASA #831; USAF #956) model will be shared > between NASA and USAF. What about aerial refueling? Will there be a KC-135Q available? # Frank Henderson | Div. of Univ. Computing # Network Services /0\ Security Administrator # X-500/Gopher Manager \_______[|(.)|]_______/ # Auburn University o ++ 0 ++ o hendefd@mail.auburn.edu ------------------------------ From: James Easton Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 13:36 BST Subject: TR-3A Many thanks to those subscribers who sent me feedback on the reports of triangular craft. Regarding... [START] Subject: TR-3A Author: Gavin Stratford at Internet Date: 1/19/95 9:59 AM [Deletion] ...an article which springs to mind was in AIR INTERNATIONAL SEPT 94 on page 142 titled "Wizard wars & air power in the 21st century - part 1". Interestingly, quote "Towards the end of the 1980's, the TR-3A began intensive flight operations, training with the F-117A it was designed to support. Because of this, and as part of the NATO co-operation programme, RAF pilots have had the chance to test fly and simulate missions with the TR-3A and it has from time to time made an appearance over the UK" !!?? [END] If the TR-3A _was_ being flown by RAF pilots as part of a NATO co-operation program, this would lend even more credence to speculation that the recent craft at Boscombe Down involved a TR-3A. If it was indeed designed to support the F-117A, the following report also falls into place: [START] Date: Wed, 25 Jan 1995 14:54:35 -0800 Subj: Groom Lake Desert Rat #21 (2/2) ----- TRIANGULAR AIRCRAFT SIGHTING ----- An experienced aviation watcher says that he and his companions saw an unacknowledged delta winged aircraft about 35 miles east of Groom on Nov. 23. This was a triangular craft with rounded corners, as has been described in the press as the "TR-3A." The witness works for a major aircraft developer in California and says that he knows aircraft well. He says the sighting took place around 7 or 8 in the evening (long after dark) as he and several companions were traveling north on US-93 for a visit to the Tikaboo Valley. South of Alamo, they stopped to watch some orange flares being dropped by jets on maneuver. These flares, intended to distract heat-seeking missiles, are a common sight in the area, but the jets themselves were not. The witness was drawn by the unusual lighting of the jets: Four had only a single red strobe on the bottom about midway down the fuselage. About four others had only three steady lights: red lights in the front and rear and a white light at mid-fuselage. The witness says that the moon had just risen, so he was able to see the outline of the aircraft from below, using low-power binoculars and looking almost directly upward from their location near the Pahranagat Lakes. The planes with the single red strobes he recognized as F-117A Stealth fighters. The other four aircraft had a distinctive triangular shape with rounded corners. Both the witness and his companion, also an aviation worker, insist that these aircraft were not B-2s, the only acknowledged craft in the U.S. arsenal that resembles that shape. [END] A "distinctive triangular shape with rounded corners", now begins to credibly explain some of the reports I had mentioned. Perhaps the most unusual characteristic is this consistently reported ability to move slowly and hover; briefly: "My daughter and I saw a triangular-shaped craft fly very low over our yard. It had rounded corners and lights in the corners and though it just skimmed the trees, it made no engine sound - only a "whoooosh"-like noise. It was not flying fast and there were one or two others in the area at the same time but not as close. It almost seemed as if they were surveying the area. There were newspaper reports soon after that confirmed our sighting but we never reported it." And: "The craft seemed to be at about 2,000 feet but it is hard to estimate distances at night. All the while no sound was heard until it was directly above us. It slowed and paused in mid-air for a second and emitted a real low but audible rumble which seemed to come on instantaneous, as if someone said "OK, turn on the sound". Most jets, civilian and military are pretty loud at this height when they are directly above you. Anyway all of us agreed it was strange but pretty much agreed that it was some kind of military aircraft. We could see a faint outline of an elongated, acute triangle with rounded edges..." This _could_ suggest an aircraft designed specifically to produce detailed reconnaissance surveys. From what is known about the TR-3A and it's purported role, would that make sense, or is it impracticable? Cheers, James. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: TEXJE@VAXB.HW.AC.UK Internet: JAMES.EASTON@STAIRWAY.CO.UK - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.fidonet.org (Michael Corbin) Date: Thu, 26 Jan 95 11:07:45 mdt Subject: TR-3A sighting ? > Something which looks like a nice sighting of the TR-3A is reported > in the Groom Lake Desert Rat # 21. Since Glenn Campbell says that > his electronic journal should be reposted entirely, not fragmented, > and since my English/American is so bad that it would be tiring to > paraphrase, I suggest that you find this issue of the Desert Rat on > the net. A short summary however: the sighting occurred on November > 23, 35 miles east of Groom. The witness is said to be an experienced > aviation watcher. He saw 4 F-117A + 4 triangular crafts with rounded > corners, which were not B-2. If this has already been discussed at length here, I apologize for this request. Could someone send me whatever information is available on the TR-3A to mcorbin@paranet.org? Much appreciated. Mike - -- Michael Corbin - via ParaNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG ====================================================================== Inquiries regarding ParaNet, or mail directed to Michael Corbin, should be sent to: mcorbin@paranet.org. Or you can phone voice at 303-429-2654/ Michael Corbin Director ParaNet Information Services ------------------------------ End of Skunk Works Digest V5 #189 ********************************* To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe skunk-works-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@mail.orst.edu". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-skunk-works": subscribe skunk-works-digest local-skunk-works@your.domain.net To unsubscribe, send mail to the same address, with the command: unsubscribe skunk-works-digest in the body. 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