From: skunk-works-digest-owner@mail.orst.edu To: skunk-works-digest@mail.orst.edu Subject: Skunk Works Digest V5 #266 Reply-To: skunk-works-digest@mail.orst.edu Errors-To: skunk-works-digest-owner@mail.orst.edu Precedence: bulk Skunk Works Digest Thursday, 11 May 1995 Volume 05 : Number 266 In this issue: [none] Re:Black Helos McDonnell Douglas humour How secret are skunk-works' secrets? See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the skunk-works or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk (John Burtenshaw) Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 09:49:22 +0100 Subject: [none] Just to add my two-pennies worth (or cents if you prefer ;-)) My ex-brother-in-law who served with the RAF in Cyprus told me once of the US helos that made a brief stop over at RAF Akrotiri during the Lebenon Hostage crisis. He said that they were black or very dark grey and remarkably quiet for helos. He was used to the old British Wessex and Sea Kings flying about and these US choppers were almost silent in comparison. Their support teams came in on Sea Stallions. British personnel were kept well away from the helos so he could not get a close up look at one. Rumour had it that they were part of rescue attempt which did not take place. This was in the Eighties. Does anyone know what they could have been - he said he thought the US crews called them Sea Bats but I've never come across them in any aircraft ident books I've looked at. Cheers John =========================================================================== John Burtenshaw Systems Administrator, The Computer Centre, Bournemouth University - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Postal Address: Talbot Campus, Fern Barrow, POOLE, Dorset, BH12 5BB U.K. Internet: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk Phone: 01202 595089 Fax: 01202 513293 AX.25: g1hok@gb7bnm.#45.gbr.eu. AMPRnet: g1hok.ampr.org. (44.131.17.82) CompuServe: 100336,3113 =========================================================================== ------------------------------ From: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk (John Burtenshaw) Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 12:04:25 +0100 Subject: Re:Black Helos Just to add my two-pennies worth (or cents if you prefer ;-)) My ex-brother-in-law who served with the RAF in Cyprus told me once of the US helos that made a brief stop over at RAF Akrotiri during the Lebenon Hostage crisis. He said that they were black or very dark grey and remarkably quiet for helos. He was used to the old British Wessex and Sea Kings flying about and these US choppers were almost silent in comparison. Their support teams came in on Sea Stallions. British personnel were kept well away from the helos so he could not get a close up look at one. Rumour had it that they were part of rescue attempt which did not take place. This was in the Eighties. Does anyone know what they could have been - he said he thought the US crews called them Sea Bats but I've never come across them in any aircraft ident books I've looked at. Cheers John =========================================================================== John Burtenshaw Systems Administrator, The Computer Centre, Bournemouth University - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Postal Address: Talbot Campus, Fern Barrow, POOLE, Dorset, BH12 5BB U.K. Internet: jburtens@bournemouth.ac.uk Phone: 01202 595089 Fax: 01202 513293 AX.25: g1hok@gb7bnm.#45.gbr.eu. AMPRnet: g1hok.ampr.org. (44.131.17.82) CompuServe: 100336,3113 =========================================================================== ------------------------------ From: James.Mangin@Eng.Sun.COM (James Mangin) Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 11:11:39 +0800 Subject: McDonnell Douglas humour Heh, hope none of you mind a little humour, I had to emerge from lurking-land to post this, my first ever on this list. Enjoy! - -James McDonnell Douglas AIRCRAFT-SPACE SYSTEMS-MISSILES Important! Important! Please fill out and mail this card within 10 days of purchase Thank you for purchasing a McDonnell Douglas military aircraft. In order to protect your new investment, please take a few moments to fill out the warranty registration card below. Answering the survey questions is not required, but the information will help us to develop new products that best meet your needs and desires. 1. _Mr. _Mrs. _Ms. _Miss _Lt. _Gen. _Comrade _Classified _Other First Name____________________Initial____Last Name_________________________ Latitude________________________Longitude__________________________________ Altitude________________________Password, Code Name, Etc.__________________ 2. Which model aircraft did you purchase? _F-14 Tomcat _F-15 Eagle _F-16 Falcon _F-19A Stealth _Classified 3. Date of purchase: Month___________Day___________Year____________ 4. Serial Number____________________ 5. Please check where this product was purchased: _Received as Gift/Aid Package _Catalog Showroom _Sleazy Arms Broker _Mail Order _Discount Store _Government Surplus _Classified 6. Please check how you became aware of the McDonnell Douglas product you have just purchased: _Heard loud noise, looked up _Store Display _Espionage _Recommended by friend/relative/ally _Political lobbying by Manufacturer _Was attacked by one 7. Please check the three (3) factors which most influenced your decision to purchase this McDonnell Douglas product: _Style/Appearance _Kickback/Bribe _Recommended by salesperson _Speed/Maneuverability _Comfort/Convenience _McDonnell Douglas Reputation _Advanced Weapons Systems _Price/Value _Back-Room Politics _Negative experience opposing one in combat 8. Please check the location(s) where this product will be used: _North America _Central/South America _Aircraft Carrier _Europe _Middle East _Africa _Asia/Far East _Misc. Third-World Countries _Classified 9. Please check the products that you currently own, or intend to purchase in the near future: Product Own Intend to purchase Color TV VCR ICBM Killer Satellite CD Player Air-to-Air Missiles Space Shuttle Home Computer Nuclear Weapon 10. How would you describe yourself or your organization? Check all that apply: _Communist/Socialist _Terrorist _Crazed (Islamic) _Crazed (Other) _Neutral _Democratic _Dictatorship _Corrupt (Latin American) _Corrupt (Other) _Primitive/Tribal 11. How did you pay for your McDonnell Douglas product? _Cash _Suitcases of Cocaine _Oil Revenues _Deficit Spending _Personal Check _Credit Card _Ransom Money _Traveler's Check 12. Occupation You Your Spouse Homemaker Sales/Marketing Revolutionary Clerical Mercenary Tyrant Middle Management Eccentric Billionaire Defense Minister/General Retired Student 13. 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Please write to: McDONNELL DOUGLAS CORPORATION Marketing Department Military Aerospace Division P.O. Box 800 St. Louis, MO 55500 ------------------------------ From: chosa@chosa.win.net (BYRON WEBER) Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 18:43:16 Subject: How secret are skunk-works' secrets? Ben Rich gave us a pretty good idea how far the gov. guys go to protect their assets. They are serious, very serious. An investigator friend called me for help with a case. He was asked to conduct an asset search of a respondent for the petitioner in a divorse action. The respondent was a career skunk-works employee. The petitioner had no idea where the respondent physically worked, just that the respondent was employed by the skunk-works, possibly in Palmdale and the respondent occassionally took three day trips on a boat to and from an unknown place. There was no phone number for the respondent's work and no way to contact the respondent during work hours. The petitioner filed a separate tax return and had never seen a tax return for the respondent. The respondent always used cash and had no known bank accounts. The petitioner estimated the respondent earned $90k a year and based on the respondents expenses gave an estimate of the respondents savings which were substantial. The asset search found next to nothing. There were no local savings accounts or credit cards, no loans, businesses, licenses, leases, accidents, civil or criminal cases or other records. The original loan note on the couple's house had the petitioner's name along with someone else's name unknown to the petitioner. The respondent had one known property in another state. That is all. A search of civil court cases didn't even find a filing for the divorse. My friend asked me to verify the almost complete lack of record for the respondent. I searched as many as 15 separate databases, each with many millions of records, there was nothing. A wider area search was initiated and a possible savings account was found in the proximity of the current NRO headquarters, but this could not be substantiated since the name on the account was incomplete and there was no signature card or social security number. Sometime later a social security number was associated with the account which turned out to be that of a sibling of the respondent. It is one thing to hide secrets, like at Groom Lake, and another to manipulate city, county, state, federal, property, banking and other financial records for one individual who knows secrets, undoubtedly SCI at that. They are very serious. ------------------------------ End of Skunk Works Digest V5 #266 ********************************* To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe skunk-works-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@mail.orst.edu". 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