From: skunk-works-digest-owner@pmihwy.com To: skunk-works-digest@pmihwy.com Subject: Skunk Works Digest V5 #758 Reply-To: skunk-works-digest@pmihwy.com Errors-To: skunk-works-digest-owner@pmihwy.com Precedence: Skunk Works Digest Wednesday, 18 December 1996 Volume 05 : Number 758 In this issue: Re: Re[2]: E-Systems It's a bird, it's a plane, it's a mystery ball! Re: Re[2]: E-Systems Re: Nuclear Powered Flights RE: ID4 and Area 51 X-33 URL Re: Nuclear Powered Flights Aviation Question X-33 Program Completes Operations Review F14 Re: F14 cockpit question See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the skunk-works or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Nick Loadholtes Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:42:03 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Re[2]: E-Systems On Tue, 17 Dec 1996, Terry Colvin wrote: > 1. I wonder where Mary Shafer got the idea that the existence of NSA > was classified until a few years ago. I entered the Naval Security > Group in 1961. It was well ... and openly ... known who DIRNSA > (Director, NSA) was and that his HQ was at Ft Meade. Her comments are > usually quite pithy and on the mark. This one was wide by a mile. True, but outside of the intel community and the miltary the NSA was almost never heard of (although they did have some rather embarassing spy problems that Bramford talked about in "The Puzzle Palace"). I remember when they finally put a sign outside of the Ft. Meade hq. because the paper made a big deal about "the last of the cold warriors" being revealed.... ************************************************************************ Nick "You rigged the olympic hockey game?" njl@crl.com "What's the matter? Don't you belive in miracles?" http://www.crl.com/~njl -the musings of a cigarette smoking man ------------------------------ From: "J. Pharabod" Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 10:27:25 MET Subject: It's a bird, it's a plane, it's a mystery ball! Not exactly skunky, but aren't you interested in things going fast and high in the sky ? J. Pharabod Excerpt from a Mark Cashman's posting to the skeptic list: (http://www.cnn.com/TECH/9612/17/mystery.ball.ap/index.html) It's a bird, it's a plane, it's a mystery ball! December 17, 1996 Web posted at: 2:30 a.m. EST SAN FRANCISCO (AP) -- A mysterious glowing ball of light traveling 1/100th the speed of light has been spotted and videotaped in the earth's upper atmosphere, but what it is has scientists puzzled. Brief footage of the image, which appeared for about 3/100th of a second at an estimated height of 80 kilometers, was presented publicly for the first time Monday at the fall meeting of the American Geophysical Union. In a six-frame sequence, the object can clearly be seen crossing upwards and left across the field of view, while retaining its shape and intense glow. "It's the first and only event of this kind photographed to my knowledge," said Dr. Dean A. Morss, assistant professor of Atmospheric Sciences at Creighton University in Nebraska. Morss is heading a research project designed to videotape luminous electrical phenomena, called sprites, in the upper atmosphere. 'Clearly moving' Scientists were observing a region of thunderstorm activity in western Kansas from a ground observation point in Nebraska when the mystery ball appeared. Navy Lt. Paul McCrone, a graduate student at Creighton, videotaped the image on August 22, using equipment on loan to the university from Los Alamos National Laboratory. "It's clearly something that does not have any mass. The angular speed is too fast to be anything at orbital velocity," said Morris B. Pongratz, a scientist with Los Alamos National Laboratory who has examined the tape. "This guy is clearly moving." Morss and his colleagues maintain the ball's tremendous speed and apparent lack of mass eliminate many commonly proffered explanations for unknown objects sighted in the atmosphere. "People are seeing new forms, new shapes, all sorts of new phenomena," Morss said. "It's not traditional meteorology." ------------------------------ From: dadams@netcom.com (Dean Adams) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 02:05:27 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Re[2]: E-Systems > > 1. I wonder where Mary Shafer got the idea that the existence of NSA > was classified until a few years ago. I entered the Naval Security > Group in 1961. It was well ... and openly ... known who DIRNSA > (Director, NSA) was and that his HQ was at Ft Meade. Maybe she was thinking of NRO... ------------------------------ From: gregd@cambertx.com (Greg Fieser) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 09:10:52 PST Subject: Re: Nuclear Powered Flights >Lee Watters wrote: > > Does anyone remember any tales about the nuclear-powered flight > experiments at the Idaho labs in the late 1950s? I'm especially > curious about how they transferred power to the engine(s). Thanks. following up from my work account... I reviewed Jay Miller's suggestion last night (an excellent source - both the book and the individual) and the Idaho lab stuff was related to the X-6 program, although no X-6s were ever built. Basically, Convair flew a live reactor around in a *heavily* :) modified B-36, designated NB-36H #51-5712. The reactor never actually powered the aircraft, but provided a lot of information on shielding, etc. By heavily modified, I mean literally *tons* of rubber and lead shielding around both the reactor (in the bomb bay) and the cockpit. I don't know the takeoff weight, but I know that earlier B-36Ds (with less powerful engines than the -J) was rated at 370,000 lbs! Speaking of the cockpit, the entire forward fuselage of the NB-36H was unique to this airframe. The classic B-36 greenhouse was replaced by a more conventional (i.e. DC-3-like) windscreen/nose design, and the windscreen itself consisted of *foot-thick* leaded glass panels! (no worries about bird strikes, I presume). For more info on the X-6 program and details on the reactor itself, see Jay's X-Plane book. I think all of the NB-36H flights were flown from the Ft. Worth facility, but I'm not sure. I know that the old service pit is now the site of GD's (excuse me, LMTAS's) flight simulator building, and there are still lots of jokes about 'glow-in-the-dark' sim pilots and engineers over there... :) Greg Fieser "nuclear power - more bang for your buck! - more glow for your dough!" ------------------------------ From: gregd@cambertx.com (Greg Fieser) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 11:00:45 PST Subject: RE: ID4 and Area 51 Slightly off-topic, but quite humorous post I received on a completely unrelated list about old Pontiacs - hope you all don't mind my sharing this with the list: >%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% > > "40 Things I Learned From ID4 That I Never Knew Before" > > By Dean Kanipe > Area 51 Research Center > > While viewing the film Independence Day, it became apparent that I > was remarkably uninformed about several things related to Area 51, > aliens, military operations, and America in general. Below is a > quick list of a few important things I learned from the film that I > never knew before, and a few lessons that were inferred from the > plot. I wish to thank the creators of ID4 for making these facts > much clearer to me. > > > 1.Aliens like to blow up significant land marks first. Apparently > the best way to destroy a city is to position your "Death Ray" over > the most recognizable building. > > 2.All pro-UFO people are morons who dance atop the building directly > under the Death Ray. > > 3.If alien "Destroyers" come to your city to blast it into oblivion, > leave BEFORE they fire the Death Ray. > > 4.If alien "Destroyers" come to your city to blast it into oblivion > and you are caught in traffic at the last minute, make sure that you > are traveling with a dog and a small child. The Law of Averages says > you'll survive the Death Ray. > > 5.If alien "Destroyers" come to your city to blast it into oblivion > and you are caught in traffic at the last minute, make sure that you > are NOT a raspy-voiced homosexual cable TV executive. The Law of > Averages says you'll get waxed by the Death Ray. > > 6.Stripping is a lucrative profession that allows one to "Pay the > bills," "take care of one's boy," and own a nice house in a middle > class subdivision. > > 7.Strippers got moxie. When the going gets tough, they can drive > California Highway Department utility vehicles, collect refugees > and use their extensive survival skills to provide food and comfort > to survivors. > > 8.NASA sends out rejection letters, just like Harvard. > > 9.Area 51 is an "Assault Base". > > 10.A fleet of RVs can travel across the Nevada Test Site in > line-abreast formation without the need of roads, thanks to the > immense expanses of Salt Flats and the lack of impeding mountains. > > 11.Area 51 has a big chain-link fence around it, and the guards at > the gate wear black combat fatigues with white metal helmets in 120 > degree heat. > > 12.Any bonehead with an RV can get to Area 51 by driving across the > Salt Flat to the gate and flashing a captured alien to the guard. > > 13.Standard operating procedure for the Air Force is to cluster all > vehicles, aircraft, and ground personnel on a 200 meter section of > tarmac in the middle of an Alien Invasion. > > 14.The F-18 is the sole fighter in use by all branches of the > service, including Marines and Air Force. > > 15.From the assault scenes on the Alien "Destroyers', it appears > that the F-18 must have had a 10,000 unit production run. > > 16.Both F-18s and B-2s must close to within 10 km of a target 20 km > across before engaging with both air-to-air missiles and aerial > launched nuclear cruise missiles. > > 17.People too drunk to walk can still fly crop dusters and F-18s. > > 18.Any bonehead with rudimentary aviation experience can be taught > to pilot an F-18 in 5 hours. > > 19.Any bonehead with F-18 flight experience can learn to pilot an > Alien fighter in 5 minutes. > > 20.Aliens with anatomy that includes tentacles and clawed feet use > flight yokes just like ours. > > 21.Aliens are wimps, even the ones in "Bio-Mechanical" armor. They > have glass jaws and can be taken out with a punch by Will Smith. > (He has had a lot of practice on photographers, though.) > > 22.Aliens are stupid. When one of their fighters approaches the > carrier, they don't bother to communicate with the pilot. > > 23.Aliens are even more stupid. They pursue their targets into > canyons walls and closing blast doors. > > 24.Aliens are unbelievably stupid. While unarmed and unarmored, they > do things to piss off people with hand guns. > > 25.Aliens are just too stupid for words to express. An alien air > traffic controller can look at a fighter that has been > human-modified for 20 minutes and is only 50 feet away and not > notice the welded-on missile rack until the missile is fired through > his work station. > > 26.Aliens are remarkably inarticulate. All they can say is, "Release > me," "No peace," and "Die!" > > 27.If you're President and your administration is faltering, an > Alien Invasion might be a good way to boost your ratings in the > polls. > > 28.If you're President and your administration is faltering, manage > to work into every other sentence the fact that you "flew in the > Persian Gulf." No need to specify what branch of service. > > 29.If you're President and your administration is faltering and an > Alien Invasion occurs, relocate the V.P., the Cabinet, and the Joint > Chiefs to one centralized location so that the Aliens can take them > all out with one shot. You can always blame the problems of the past > on them after victory is achieved. > > 30.The President's Press secretary keeps her cell phone listed in > the phone book "in case of emergencies." > > 31.If your father abandons his Jewish beliefs after the death of > your mother, always carry around a Torah and a Yarmulke. Aliens > might attack and offer him a chance to renew his faith. > > 32.If aliens abduct you and effectively destroy your life by making > you the laughing stock of the community, never fear. When their > "Destroyers" come, you will be vindicated to those who mocked your > tale. > > 33.If aliens abduct you and do unspeakable things to you, you can > have revenge upon them by flying an F-18 into their Death Ray. > > 34.If aliens abduct you and do unspeakable things to you and you > have revenge upon them by flying an F-18 into their Death Ray, you > will obtain redemption and your children will be proud of you. > > 35.The best way to win back a former wife is to be very annoying, > look perpetually vexed, and keep wearing your wedding ring for 4 > years after the divorce. > > 36.In 10 hours, one man with a Macintosh Laptop can code a virus in > C++ that will take down a completely alien computer system. > > 37.Even though the Mac isn't compatible with most other Earthly > operating systems, it can interface with an alien computer. > > 38.Alien network security is nonexistent. > > 39.Rather than attacking a planet when they first encounter it (ie, > 1940s), aliens wait until the planet has developed just enough > technology to possibly defend itself. > > 40.Scientists at Area 51 are a bit touched in the head, and "Don't > get out much." > > >%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% > - -----------------End of Original Message----------------- - ------------------------------------- Greg Fieser 12/18/96 gregd@cambertx.com 11:00:45 AM aka habu@why.net - ------------------------------------- ------------------------------ From: JOHN SZALAY Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 16:21:09 EST Subject: X-33 URL In the event that you missed the URL for X-33 program information & Images, heres what the NASA PAO sent out. X-33: http://rlv.msfc.nasa.gov/x33/index.html John Szalay jpszalay@tacl.dnet.ge.com ( Taking a MUCH needed 3 week vacation, from the stupidity of it all! ) ( still surfing the net, but would rather be back, bodysurfing at Makapuu ) *------------------------------------------------- Danger: Avoid looking into laser with remaining eye ! ------------------------------ From: Frank Markus Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 17:27:56 -0500 Subject: Re: Nuclear Powered Flights Does anybody have a source for the Jay Miller "X-Planes" book? I gather that is out of print. If someone has a copy that they would be willing to sell me, please reply privately. ------------------------------ From: "Terry Colvin" Date: Wed, 18 Dec 96 16:08:30 GMT Subject: Aviation Question ____________________________ Forward Header __________________________________ Subject: Aviation Question Author: John Platt at FHU1 Date: 18/12/96 11:45 Hi Terry: Wondered if any of your Skunk Works List folks could provide info on: Drone Hellcats used during the Korean War, as flying bombs, against bridges and other targets. Designation may have been QF6F, perhaps used in 1950, not later than 1951. If there is info, how successful were they? Assuming they were carrier based, what carrier(s) and squadron(s)? What was the color scheme (I assume overall Navy blue) What were the distinguishing physical characteristics (I assume at least one or more antennae; were the windows plated over?) What were the payloads? What were the pilot aircraft? Were they single seaters? Did the enemy try to jam the control signals? Thanks, John Platt ------------------------------ From: gregweigold@pmsc.com (GREG WEIGOLD) Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 19:17:12 -0500 Subject: X-33 Program Completes Operations Review Just in case those on the list might have missed the PR release Greg Weigold Columbia, SC gregweigold@pmsc.com ______________________________ Forward Header __________________________________ Subject: X-33 Program Completes Operations Review Author: NASANews@hq.nasa.gov at Internet Date: 12/18/96 3:16 PM Jim Cast Headquarters, Washington, DC December 18, 1996 (Phone: 202/358-1779) Sender: owner-press-release Precedence: bulk Dom Amatore Marshall Space Flight Center, Hunstville, AL (Phone: 205/544-0031) Ron Lindeke Lockheed Martin Skunk Works, Palmdale, CA (Phone: 805/572-4153) RELEASE: 96-263 X-33 PROGRAM COMPLETES OPERATIONS REVIEW For the second time in as many months, government and industry managers have successfully completed a Preliminary Design Review (PDR) for the X-33 technology demonstration program. This design review for the operations segment and ground systems segment of the X-33 represents the last in a series of PDRs. The three day PDR conducted last week in California, with NASA and industry team members in attendance, confirmed readiness to begin detailed design of the X-33 Ground Support System and Launch Facility at Edwards Air Force Base, CA. Last month, a week-long PDR approved a baseline configuration for final detailed vehicle design and long-lead procurement. The next major milestones for the program are a series of Critical Design Reviews (CDRs) starting in January and culminating in an August Operations CDR. Construction of a 25-acre launch facility at Edwards is expected to begin in October 1997. The X-33, a half-scale technology demonstrator, is scheduled to make as many as fifteen flights during a 10- month period, beginning in March 1999. Launched vertically from Edwards, it will fly up to 15 times the speed of sound at altitudes approaching 50 miles. Potential landing sites are located in California, Utah, Montana and the state of Washington. The flagship vehicle in the agency's Reusable Launch Vehicle (RLV) program, X-33 is intended to pave the way for a full scale, commercially-developed RLV after the turn of the century, which could dramatically reduce the cost of putting payloads into space. - end - ------------------------------ From: "David D. Hawes" Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 20:24:53 -0500 Subject: F14 Hey yall, This isn't specificly Skunk-works related, but bare with me. My housemates and I were watching Top Gun last night on TBS and we got into a discussion on how the cockpit scenes with the actors were shot. Anyone know anything about this? One possibility suggested was that the actor sat in the front seat while a real pilot sat in the RIO seat and flew the plane. Can the F14 be flown from the backseat? I suppose if there were a trainer version of the F14, that might have worked, what about the service F14? I guess the simplest suggestion was that they had a mock-up of the cockpit and just inserted background..etc for the shot. Dave ____________________________________________________________________________ /\ ____ /\ . ' \+\\VV//+/ . _/\_ ' . . \\// . <========> ' \/ oyager@wpi.edu []:::::\__/ ' . , . " " . . " " @@@ {}{}{} @@@ [][][] @@@ ()()() @@@ [][][] @@@ {}{}{} @@@ &&&&& David D. Hawes @@@@@@@@@ http://www.jax.org/~dhawes &&&&&&&&&&& %%%%% ################ Http://www.wpi.edu/~voyager/ ############ %%%%%% ------------------------------ From: Side Show Marc Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 19:26:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: F14 cockpit question Hey all, One I can answer. (I know more about film than skunky aircraft.) In the movie TopGun, director Tony Scott had cockpit mockups monuted on a gimble that could pitch and yaw. The backgrounds were projected onto a rear projection screen (not matted in) and a single light (12K?) was added to provide the "sun." Happy Christmass. ___________ Marc Studer ___________________________________________ "Life is a fair approximation of reality." - Jacques Portman "Two plus two equals Duh." - Jacques Portman ______________________________________ mstuder@spu.edu ___________ On Wed, 18 Dec 1996, David D. Hawes wrote: > Hey yall, > This isn't specificly Skunk-works related, but bare with me. My > housemates and I were watching Top Gun last night on TBS and we got into a > discussion on how the cockpit scenes with the actors were shot. Anyone know > anything about this? > One possibility suggested was that the actor sat in the front seat > while a real pilot sat in the RIO seat and flew the plane. Can the F14 be > flown from the backseat? I suppose if there were a trainer version of the > F14, that might have worked, what about the service F14? > I guess the simplest suggestion was that they had a mock-up of the > cockpit and just inserted background..etc for the shot. > > Dave > ____________________________________________________________________________ > /\ ____ /\ . ' > \+\\VV//+/ . _/\_ ' . . > \\// . <========> ' > \/ oyager@wpi.edu []:::::\__/ ' . , . > " " . . > " " > @@@ {}{}{} @@@ [][][] @@@ ()()() @@@ [][][] @@@ {}{}{} @@@ > &&&&& David D. Hawes @@@@@@@@@ http://www.jax.org/~dhawes &&&&&&&&&&& > %%%%% ################ Http://www.wpi.edu/~voyager/ ############ %%%%%% > > ------------------------------ End of Skunk Works Digest V5 #758 ********************************* To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe skunk-works-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@pmihwy.com". 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