From: skunk-works-digest-owner@pmihwy.com To: skunk-works-digest@pmihwy.com Subject: Skunk Works Digest V6 #23 Reply-To: skunk-works-digest@pmihwy.com Errors-To: skunk-works-digest-owner@pmihwy.com Precedence: Skunk Works Digest Friday, 28 February 1997 Volume 06 : Number 023 In this issue: [none] BBC program on British overflights.... Skunk Works Digest Wednesday, 26 February 1997 Volume 06 : Number 022 Re: BBC program on British overflights.... Re: Skunk Works Digest Wednesday, 26 February 1997 Volume 06 : Number 022 Stealth formula Stealth formula Re: Stealth formula Re: Stealth formula B-2 Engine info? UAV BattleLab Website duplicate messages FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the skunk-works or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to retrieve back issues. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Dan Zinngrabe Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 02:59:20 -0500 Subject: [none] Here's a little history of the Tier 3 and it's development: 1991-1992: The program we know as Aurora (I am refering to the "pulser", not the "XB-70") is terminated due to cost overruns- possibly only production is terminated and several articles are left flying in limited operational status. This was apparently just after the program reached an IOC milestone. 1992-1993: The Tier 3 UAV program is started by Lockheed (possibly without an RFP from USAF/DARO/etc.) as a partial replacement for the Aurora. I say partial because the Aurora's original mission(s) were not "viable" any more due to the fall of the USSR and thus the drastic changes in US policy (specifically SIOP). Tier 3 was initated by dusting off the Skunk Works entry into the Advanced Technology Bomber competition and begining from there. It was decided that the first few aircraft would be manned until the bugs were worked out on the software side (no, it wasn't running JavaScript or Win95!). 1993-1994: The design phase is completed and the first 1-2 airframes are completed. Some major changes were made to the old ATB design, notably an increase in low speed manueverability for over-the-target loitering and the first known use of "active stealth" (which I have been told is a form of phase conjugation EW not unlike "rubber mirror" technology developed for astronomy and SDI work). Cost per production unit is over $200 million for a run of 20-30 aircraft. By the summer of 1994 at least one aircraft was flying (manned) at Groom. The aircraft is nicknamed "Q", either for the mysterious character on "Star Trek" (who pops up everywhere with no warning and observes "inferior" races while creating havoc with the universe) or for "Quantum leap in technology". Different people say it's for different things. 1994: The program is deemed too expensive, like the program it was created to replace. Not long after the first round of flight tests the axe is dropped and the program is terminated, though some development and flight test work continues on the existing airframe(s) to this day. 1994-1995: To replace Tier 3 the "white" programs Tier 3- "Darkstar" and Tier 2+ "GlobalHawk" are begun, and their development is well documented throughout the press. As a sidenote, Lockheed has the Air Force interested in a "baby Q" which is larger and stealthier than the Darkstar, though not as large or expensive as the Tier 3. This is based on my own research, from open literature and speaking with a number of people involved with a several different programs and offices. Comments, ?s, etc. ? Sorry for the kinda long post. :( Dan Z ------------------------------ From: John Stone Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 10:21:47 -0500 Subject: BBC program on British overflights.... Hi, A while back some one posted a blurb about a BBC program on British participation in Russian overflights. They also mentioned that (if I remember correctly) that there was a companion book? Could someone post that info again or privatly email that to me? I've lost the original post. Thanks, John | / ^ \ ___|___ -(.)==<.>==(.)- --------o---((.))---o-------- SR-71 Blackbird U-2 Dragon Lady John Stone jstone@thepoint.net U-2 and SR-71 Web Page:http://www.thepoint.net/~jstone/blackbird.html ------------------------------ From: George de Peyster Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 07:41:28 -0700 Subject: Skunk Works Digest Wednesday, 26 February 1997 Volume 06 : Number 022 Three Copies ------------------------------ From: drbob@creighton.edu Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 10:01:14 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: BBC program on British overflights.... The original BBC documentary on spy flights which highlighted the RAF involvement did not have its own dedicated companion book, per se. The program's producer, Paul Lashmar, has written many articles on this subject and has just published a general book on the subject. It covers not only the recon flights mentioned in the first documentary but incorporates considerable material from his second show which aired last week on A&E on General Curt LeMay, overflights, and WWIII. The reference for this book is: Lashmar, Paul. _Spy Flights of the Cold War_. Annapolis, MD: Naval Institute Press, 1996. ISBN 1-55750-837-2. Outside of the United States and Canada the book is published by Sutton Publishing, but I do not know their ISBN number. I believe the price for this hardback book, 244 pages, 32 pages of b&w photos, and index is US$29.95. NIP has an 800 number and can take orders via the internet and their web site. Robert Hopkins ------------------------------ From: mrw@netdirect.net (Mark Wilson) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 12:47:36 -0600 Subject: Re: Skunk Works Digest Wednesday, 26 February 1997 Volume 06 : Number 022 >Three Copies two here, always have since the switch. ------------------------------ From: Steve Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 15:11:33 -0500 Subject: Stealth formula I'm planning on doing a project this year on stealth technology, and I'd like to build a model that is actually invisible to radar. In a book by Ben Rich, I read that this formula could be applied to any object, rendering it invisible to radar. Where might I get the formula used to design of the facets on the F-117? Also, since the B2 is also stealthy, I was wondering if it uses the same equation..? Thanks.. Steve King stevek@bmts.com ------------------------------ From: Steve Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 15:13:44 -0500 Subject: Stealth formula In the post about the stealth formula, when I said it could be applied to any object, I meant it could be used when designing the surface curves/facets.. Steve King ------------------------------ From: larry@ichips.intel.com Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 13:59:02 -0800 Subject: Re: Stealth formula Steve King writes: >>I'm planning on doing a project this year on stealth technology, and I'd >>like to build a model that is actually invisible to radar. In a book by >>Ben Rich, I read that this formula could be applied to any object, >>rendering it invisible to radar. Where might I get the formula used to >>design of the facets on the F-117? Also, since the B2 is also stealthy, >>I was wondering if it uses the same equation..? >In the post about the stealth formula, when I said it could be applied >to any object, I meant it could be used when designing the surface >curves/facets.. The general 'formula' is Maxwell's Equations, solved for the details of the model you have in mind, the radar source you're interested in being invisible from, and the radar propogation medium your model is immersed in. These are not simple problems, but there are probably some already worked out solutions for certain shapes that you could tap which have simple formulas. Not having any idea as to your training in the math and physics involved, the best general source on this I've found to date is: "Radar and Laser Cross Section Engineering" by David Jenn of the Naval Postgraduate School. Prediction, reduction, and measurement of electromagnetic scattering from complex three-dimensional targets is the primary emphasis of this text, developed by the author from courses taught at the Naval Postgraduate School. The analysis methods discussed focus on physical optics and numerical solutions to Maxwell's equations (the method of moments and finite-difference solutions) as they apply to radar cross section (RCS). Numerous examples have been included to illustrate the application of important methods and concepts. Written as an instructional text, this book is recommended for upper-level undergraduate and graduate students. Also a good reference book for engineers in industry. AIAA textbook 1995 520pp Cloth ISBN 1-56347-105-1 AIAA Members $74.95 List price $89.95 On the above book, some of the worked out examples may be for simple shapes and have simple algebraic RCS rules that you could use directly in your project. But looking at the book at least would be a good introduction of what's involved in the field. Here's another useful source: "Radar Cross Section/Stealth Technology Short Course" Dr. Jenn's recently updated short course was designed for the nonstealth specialist. Even the nonengineer will be able to grasp the essential concepts from the course's descriptive materials. The emphasis is on stealth as applied to radar frequencies or radar cross section (RCS). Call AIAA Customer Service for a complete course description and exact dates 202-646-7400 or 800-NEW-AIAA and ask for Operator #5. Now, once your all educated on stealth, you'll of course want to design your own flying wing UFO to amaze your friends. Here is a book which can get you started on that: "Tailless Aircraft in Theory and Practice" Kurt Nickel and Michael Wohlfahrt, University of Freiburg, Germany Nickel and Wohlfahrt are mathematicians at the University of Freiburg in Germany who have steeped themselves in aerodynamic theory and practice, creating this definitive work explaining the mysteries of tailless aircraft flight. For many years Nickel has been a close associate of the Horten brothers, renowned for their revolutionary tailless designs. The text has been translated from the German "Schwanzlose Flugzeuge" (1990, Birkhauser Verlag, Basel) by test pilot Captain Eric M. Brown, RN. Alive with enthusiasm and academic precision, this book will appeal to both amateurs and professional aerodynamicists. AIAA textbook 1994 498 pp Cloth ISBN 1-56347-094-2 AIAA Members $59.95 List proce $79.95 The Nickel and Wohlfahrt book concentrates on stable designs. Much interest these days is on unstable designs, but you can read up on those next. You can order these books from AIAA at: 1-800-682-2422 You might also check your local engineering university library for these books. Larry ------------------------------ From: dadams@netcom.com (Dean Adams) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 1997 14:27:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Stealth formula > I'm planning on doing a project this year on stealth technology, and I'd > like to build a model that is actually invisible to radar. In a book by > Ben Rich, I read that this formula could be applied to any object, > rendering it invisible to radar. Where might I get the formula used to > design of the facets on the F-117? Call up the Skunk Works and ask them for a copy of "ECHO-1". :) > Also, since the B2 is also stealthy, > I was wondering if it uses the same equation..? The B-2 uses a more advanced version that can handle blended/curved shapes, rather than just facets. ------------------------------ From: Dan Zinngrabe Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 01:35:00 -0500 Subject: B-2 Engine info? Anyone know of sources of inon on the B-2's F118 enignes? I beleive they are derrived from the B-1's engines, but how are they different? Thanks Dan ------------------------------ From: Dan Zinngrabe Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 01:54:46 -0500 Subject: UAV BattleLab Website Here's a new website dedicated to UAVs- pretty nice for a DoD site. The usual number of ".mil only" areas though :( http://www.wg53.eglin.af.mil/battlelab/default.html Dan ------------------------------ From: jaz5@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 02:02:54 -0600 (CST) Subject: duplicate messages I keep getting duplicate messages, but other times single ones. I've got six duplicate messages and two singles. ------------------------------ From: Andy C Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 10:33:14 -0000 Subject: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film So whats the feeling on this ....... andy C - ---------- From: Martin Adamson Sent: 28 February 1997 10:19 To: forteana@ftp1.primenet.com Subject: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film The Times February 28 1997 WORLD NEWS Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film THE Pentagon is bracing itself for calls from conspiracy theorists after news that Area 51, a top-secret site where the American Government tests stealth aircraft and is alleged to have held captured UFOs, has been revealed on camera (Anjana Ahuja writes). The film, made in 1964, does not record details of the site but shows a scientist chalking on a blackboard the phrase "move out to Area 51". The authorities have never acknowledged the site, and often deny its existence. The footage was uncovered by Hugh McDaid while shooting Robot Warriors, a documentary on unmanned aircraft. According to Mr McDaid, the film was a top-secret briefing film for military and intelligence personnel. The scientist shown writing on the blackboard was Clarence "Kelly" Johnson, who designed the Lockheed U2 spy plane. The refusal of the USAF to confirm or deny anything regarding the site has fuelled speculation that it is a cover for something more sinister than testing new aircraft. Some believe the US Government has captured flying saucers and used the base to conduct experiments on the vehicles and their inhabitants. ------------------------------ From: Wayne Busse Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 14:18:23 -0600 Subject: Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film Andy C wrote: > > So whats the feeling on this ....... > > Subject: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film > > Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film > > THE Pentagon is bracing itself for calls from conspiracy theorists > after news that Area 51, a top-secret site where the American > Government tests stealth aircraft and is alleged to have held captured > UFOs, has been revealed on camera (Anjana Ahuja writes). > > The film, made in 1964, does not record details of the site but shows > a scientist chalking on a blackboard the phrase "move out to Area 51". > The authorities have never acknowledged the site, and often deny its > existence. Disclosing the name "Area 51", will have no effect on the Government, or on conspiracy theorists, as this has been a non-issue for some time. Ben Rich explains the genesis of the operating location in his book, "Skunk Works", and it has been known by several names, including: "Dreamland", "Paradise Ranch", "Watertown Strip" and by just, "The Ranch". There is no evidence, either written or photographic, that anything existed there prior to the mid-50's, when the U-2 program was gearing up. re: The President's Exemption of the Air Force's Operating Facility near Groom Lake at: http://www.ufomind.com/area51/desertrat/1995/dr31/exemption.html also the Oxcart Story at: http://www.sky.net/~wings/oxcart.htm - -- Wayne Busse wings@sky.net wbusse@johnco.cc.ks.us ------------------------------ From: dadams@netcom.com (Dean Adams) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 14:25:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film > February 28 1997 WORLD NEWS > Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film > > THE Pentagon is bracing itself for calls from conspiracy theorists after news > that Area 51, a top-secret site where the American Government tests stealth > aircraft and is alleged to have held captured UFOs, has been revealed on > camera (Anjana Ahuja writes). > > The film, made in 1964, does not record details of the site but shows a > scientist chalking on a blackboard the phrase "move out to Area 51". The > authorities have never acknowledged the site, and often deny its existence. > > The footage was uncovered by Hugh McDaid while shooting Robot Warriors, a > documentary on unmanned aircraft. Sounds like another fine example of the ignorance and cluelessness of many "UFO researchers". I'd say the majority of people on this list have seen that "uncovered" footage MANY times. It is a staple of virtually every documentary on the Blackbird. These people also seem to have somehow missed the fact that the government DID acknowledge the existence of the base several years ago. ------------------------------ From: larry@ichips.intel.com Date: Fri, 28 Feb 1997 14:29:54 -0800 Subject: Re: FW: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film andy C writes: >So whats the feeling on this ....... >>From: Martin Adamson >>Sent: 28 February 1997 10:19 >>To: forteana@ftp1.primenet.com >>Subject: Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film >> >>The Times >> >>February 28 1997 WORLD NEWS >> >> >>Pentagon 'UFO' site revealed on film >> >>THE Pentagon is bracing itself for calls from conspiracy theorists after news >>that Area 51, a top-secret site where the American Government tests stealth >>aircraft and is alleged to have held captured UFOs, has been revealed on >>camera (Anjana Ahuja writes). >> >>The film, made in 1964, does not record details of the site but shows a >>scientist chalking on a blackboard the phrase "move out to Area 51". The >>authorities have never acknowledged the site, and often deny its existence. >> >>The footage was uncovered by Hugh McDaid while shooting Robot Warriors, a >>documentary on unmanned aircraft. >> >>According to Mr McDaid, the film was a top-secret briefing film for military >>and intelligence personnel. The scientist shown writing on the blackboard was >>Clarence "Kelly" Johnson, who designed the Lockheed U2 spy plane. >> >>The refusal of the USAF to confirm or deny anything regarding the site has >>fuelled speculation that it is a cover for something more sinister than >>testing new aircraft. Some believe the US Government has captured flying >>saucers and used the base to conduct experiments on the vehicles and their >>inhabitants. Here's the feeling, it's good that you asked! The film is NOT a new find. It had been aired on cable TV many times in the past. For example, it was aired on 4 Dec 91 on the Discovery Channel's "Wings" program on the SR-71. This is what was on the blackboard: Schedule for #121 Feb 17 - Aircraft Complete Feb 18 - Aircraft put down on its gear Feb 19 - Feb 22 - Engineering Final Tests Feb 23 - 25 - Disassemble and load on trucks Feb 26 - 4:00 AM - Move out to Area 51 ------- -------------- ------- (the "4:00 AM" and "out to Area 51" were underlined, "4:00 AM" was HEAVILY underlined), (in fact, if I recall accurately from the film, Kelly can be seen heavily underlining 4:00 AM for emphasis). This is mundane stuff, as it was the final Lockheed plant checkout schedule for the very first A-12, Article #121, shipped to the test facility at Groom Lake. Since A-12 Article #121 first flew in April of 1962 from Groom Lake, looking at the dates on the blackboard, and the confirmation verbage in OXCART History, that meeting was held at least in 1962, and maybe even towards the end of 1961, so the film in question couldn't have been shot in 1964, as McDaid thinks, or was told. In fact, I posted the above verbage here in the Skunk Works mail list soon after this program aired back in 1991! I remember us discussing on this mail list in fact, that here we have evidence for existence of the term 'Area 51' back in the 1961-1962 time period. Larry ------------------------------ End of Skunk Works Digest V6 #23 ******************************** To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe skunk-works-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@pmihwy.com". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-skunk-works": subscribe skunk-works-digest local-skunk-works@your.domain.net To unsubscribe, send mail to the same address, with the command: unsubscribe skunk-works-digest in the body. Administrative requests, problems, and other non-list mail can be sent to either "skunk-works-digest-owner@pmihwy.com" or, if you don't like to type a lot, "georgek@netwrx1.com". A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "skunk-works-digest" in the commands above with "skunk-works". Back issues are available for e-mail request by sending a message to majordomo@pmihwy.com with no subject and a line containing "get skunk-works-digest vNN.nMMM" (where "NN" is the volume number, and "MMM" is the issue number). You can get a list of all available digests by sending the one line command "index skunk-works-digest". If you have any questions or problems please contact me at: georgek@netwrx1.com Thanks, George R, Kasica