From: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com (skunk-works-digest) To: skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Subject: skunk-works-digest V7 #31 Reply-To: skunk-works Sender: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Errors-To: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Precedence: bulk skunk-works-digest Tuesday, June 23 1998 Volume 07 : Number 031 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 01:52:33 GMT From: georgek@netwrx1.com (George R. Kasica) Subject: Digest Error is corrected Hello: As you may have noticed, there was an error in the Digest Volume and Issue Numbers. The cause has ben identified and hopefully corrected. Also the lack of header and trailer information has been corrected. We'll know on the next digest run. I have relabeled the issue with the proper Volume 7 Issue 30 designation in the archives available from http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works Sorry for any inconvenienced, George ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 414 541 8579 Skunk-Works ListOwner +1 800 816 2568 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com West Allis, WI USA georgek@netwrx1.com Digest Issues at: http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Jun 1998 17:35:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Wei-Jen Su Subject: F-22 article There is a nice article about the F-22 in the Air & Space Smithsonian magazine June/July 1998, Vol. 13 # 2. May the Force be with you Su Wei-Jen E-mails: wsu02@utopia.poly.edu wjs@webspan.net "What's the purpose of the propeller? To keep the pilot cool. If you don't think so, just stop it and watch him sweat!" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Jun 1998 23:53:03 GMT From: georgek@netwrx1.com (George R. Kasica) Subject: Finally back in business Well, with the successful post of a message by Su Wei-Jen today it seems that the list is back among the living so to speak. The Digests are also available at the usual web site address of http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works. Any questions or problems please let me know, ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 414 541 8579 Skunk-Works ListOwner +1 800 816 2568 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com West Allis, WI USA georgek@netwrx1.com Digest Issues at: http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 07:29:16 GMT From: georgek@netwrx1.com (George R. Kasica) Subject: (fwd) info about US Air Force air shows in Japan I know this is slightly off topic but can anyone help him out? Send anything you may know directly to him. Thanks, George On Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:03:38 +0900, "Bernard Languillier" wrote: >Dear Sir, > >Being a Belgian airfan currently living in Japan, I was recently looking for >information about the dates and locations of the airshows set up by the US >Air Force in its Japanese bases. > >Although you main interest seems to be very different from mine, I thought >that you might know a web page or another online information source where I >could find this kind of information. > >Please forgive me if this e.mail is any troublesome for you. > >Best regards from Japan, > >Bernard Languillier > > ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 414 541 8579 Skunk-Works ListOwner +1 800 816 2568 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com West Allis, WI USA georgek@netwrx1.com Digest Issues at: http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jun 1998 10:19:20 -0700 From: tonydinkel@clubnet.net Subject: off topic supersonic question I have an off topic question about supersonic shock waves. I have watched Space Shuttle launches on nasa select for many years and have wondered why it seems as though the shockwaves (2 of them) can be seen moving through the srb plume. Are these really the shockwaves? What makes them visible? And what causes the white cloud-like effect on the leading tips of the structures? This effect seems to vary in intensity on different days. I am an engineer, but not in astronautics so feel free to be as technical as you need to be. I will figure it out. Reply off list if you wish. td ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 08:16:02 EDT From: CatshotKim@aol.com Subject: re: supersonic question The shock waves you have seen during shuttle ascent are generated during the period called "max Q". This is the time at which dynamic pressure on the vehicle reaches a peak. Part of that dynamic pressure is generated by the vehicle reaching mach 1. It becomes visible because of the humidity prevalent here by the sea. The pressure causes the humid air to condense momentarily. The same thing occurs on a smaller scale during formula 1 and champ car races on humid days. As pressure increases around the wings, the humid air condenses causing visible vortices. I have a rather striking postcard at home that shows a supersonic F-14 with a visible conical shockwave surrounding the fuselage. Kim Keller ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 05:38:06 +0100 (CET) From: 849y4l <849y4l@mci.com> Subject: [none] Authenticated sender is <849y4l@mci.com> Subject: 84 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit EMAIL MARKETING WORKS!! Bull's Eye Gold is the PREMIER email address collection tool. This program allows you to develop TARGETED lists of email addresses. Doctors, florists, MLM, biz opp,...you can collect anything...you are only limited by your imagination! You can even collect email addresses for specific states, cities, and even countries! 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Tankers support F-117 trek across Atlantic by Tech. Sgt. Joe Bela U.S. Air Forces in Europe Public Affairs OVER THE ATLANTIC OCEAN (AFNS) -- Seven air refueling aircraft left Moron Air Base, Spain, June 9 to support the redeployment of six F-117s from Southwest Asia following President Clinton's decision to reduce U.S. forces in the Gulf region. The stealth fighters are heading home to Holloman Air Force Base, N.M. The five KC-135 Stratotankers and two KC-10 Extenders are part of an "air bridge" that includes C-5 Galaxy transport planes carrying troops and equipment to the United States. Units supporting the F-117 refueling operation over the Atlantic include Royal Air Force Base Mildenhall, England; McConnell AFB, Kan., Travis AFB, Calif., and McGuire AFB, N.J. The tankers refueled the six stealth fighters 27 times before they reached the U.S. East Coast, according to Maj. James Ogenowski, tanker plan coordinator at Moron. "The tankers' job is to ensure the F-117s have sufficient fuel to make it to an abort base if for some reason they can't take on gas," he said. "In automobile terms, the gas gauge never goes below three-quarters (full) so they (F-117s) can make it to a suitable landing site in case of an in-flight emergency. Ogenowski said the tankers have two things the F-117s need to make it home. "From a tanker's perspective, we have to provide continuous escort because F-117s don't have the navigation capability that tankers do, and obviously, we've got the gas." Mildenhall's role with the redeployment of F-117s began earlier when KC-135 air crews from the 100th Air Refueling Wing were notified they would be going to Souda Bay Naval Air Station in Crete. "Five KC-135s flew to Souda Bay June 2 to support air refueling there," said Capt. Richard Mehl, a KC-135 co-pilot with the 351st Air Refueling Squadron. The tankers refueled F-15, B-1B and F-117s while operating from Souda Bay, Mehl said. Three of the five tankers left Souda Bay June 9 to provide gas for six F-117s en route to Moron. The following day, the tankers and jets took off on the last leg of the air bridge. "We provided the gas the jets needed over the Atlantic before heading home to Mildenhall," said Staff Sgt. David Stadnicki, boom operator with the 351st ARS. Stadnicki refueled two F-117s three times during the seven-hour mission over the Atlantic. "We escorted the F-117s halfway across the ocean and refueled them along the way so that another tanker from McConnell could take them the rest of the way," he said. Mission accomplished, "we then made our turn back to Mildenhall," said Mehl. "That's our job. That's what we live for at Mildenhall. USAFE is our theater. We take great pride in moving the forces. It's always great to see the bright smiling faces on the way out. It's always a lot more fun to bring the troops back home." (Courtesy of USAFE News Service) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 08:28:04 EDT From: CatshotKim@aol.com Subject: supersonic question, pt. 2 Tony, I went back and re-read your question, then realized I had only answered part of it. You referred to a shock wave visible in the plume. I have seen the effect you are referring to, and believe it is a video effect caused by one of the tracking cameras. It only appears on one camera view and looks like video synchronization lines. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure the shock wave doesn't impinge on the SRB plume. Kim Keller ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 15:19:29 -0700 From: patrick Subject: I hate it when the smoke in the cockpit is gray. LANGLEY AIR FORCE BASE, Va. (AFNS) -- Air Combat Command has released the Aircraft Accident Investigation Report on the Feb. 18 crash of a B-1B near Marion, Ky. The B-1B was from the 7th Bomb Wing, Dyess Air Force Base, Texas. The accident happened more than three hours into a six-hour routine training mission consisting of air refueling and low-level training. The report concludes that the accident sequence began when the No. 3 engine auxiliary drive system light lit up, warning the crew of possible low oil pressure or over temperature in the No. 3 engine accessory gear box. The aircrew immediately initiated the B-1B Emergency Engine Shutdown checklist. When the No. 3 engine fire push button on the Fire Warning Extinguisher Panel was pressed, a short circuit occurred across the panel. The short circuit closed the firewall shut-off valves of engines one, two and four, lit up the fire warning lights on engines two, three and four, and produced gray smoke in the cockpit. Within 78 seconds of depressing the No. 3 engine fire push button, an uncommanded shutdown of the other three engines resulted in the loss of all hydraulic and electrical power in the aircraft. Without generators and hydraulic pumps, the pilots were unable to restart the engines or to control the aircraft. The four crewmembers safely ejected. They were Lt. Col. Daniel Charchian, pilot; Capt. Jeffrey Sabella, pilot; Capt. Kevin Schields, navigator; and 1st Lt. Bert Winslow, navigator. The aircraft was destroyed on impact in a pasture. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 07:08:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Joseph F. Donoghue" Subject: Has the list died? Its been "nil heard" for a while now. Did all that recent hard work by George go for naught? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 07:34:00 -0400 (EDT) From: "Joseph F. Donoghue" Subject: Bob Ericson Chris Pocock had difficulty posting his remarks on the passing of Bob Ericson to the Skunk-works list so I'm giving it a shot. I suspect I'm not the only one on the list who knew Bob. Chris' remarks follow. Joe Donoghue BOB ERICSON For an unsung hero, look no further than U-2 pilot Robert J. Ericson, who died on 10th June after a long battle with the big C. As my interest in this unique aircraft grew, I quickly realized that - as the saying goes - Bob had "been there, done that, and got the T-shirt!" He flew the U-2 for nearly 30 years, logging over 4,300 hours on the type. He was part of that select group which soared in the Angel over denied territory, on missions which brought back intelligence of the greatest significance to the US and its allies. The monster Soviet ICBM at Tyuratam, the nuclear weapons test sites at Semipalatinsk and Lop Nor, the missiles in Cuba, the Hanoi railyards...Bob flew over them all. And quite often, he had MiGs for company, some thousands of feet below. After 15 years of this, he swapped cloak and dagger for the scientist's white coat, flying U-2s on research missions for NASA. In all those years, Bob had to write off one Angel, but saved countless others through quick thinking and cool airmanship. Early in the program, he took the alternative route back to terra firma, bailing out during a training flight over Arizona. Later, there were defunct fuel feeds, frozen elevators,...and even a total instrument failure - at night. Bob battled them all, and brought the planes home. I met him in retirement, and as the former bad guys slowly revealed their side of the U-2 story, Bob was amused to hear me describe their attempts to shoot him down, especially on that last successful overflight of the USSR in April 1960. The Soviets never got his hide, but they did get his prized hunting knife. Before he strapped Frank Powers into the cockpit on that fateful MayDay, Bob gave Frank that knife for his seat pack. Thirty-five years later, he was still fretting about it. More than once, he asked if I could help retrieve the knife from Moscow. Well, Bob, I'm sorry you never got your knife back. But you got my respect, and the respect of your peers in that unique fraternity of yours. I think that meant more to you, than the public recognition you could never enjoy. Chris Pocock "Information is useless without Intelligence" UKdragon@aol.com tel or fax +44 1895 259317 Dragon's Dream, Grove Lane, Uxbridge, UB8 3RG, U.K. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 07:54:24 -0500 From: "Tom C Robison" Subject: Re: Has the list died? Since it is real quiet here, I'll ask a question I posed to another list: - ---------------------- Last week we were treated to two incidents of Air Force One allegedly "disappearing" from air traffic control radar, an anomaly that was explained away as "software glitches" Now today I see another blurb that they've had a similar experience with Air Force Two. I accept that any radar can have it's off days, but one must wonder... Does the presidential aircraft fleet have some sort of active system aboard that can "cancel out" it's radar return? Seems to me like this would be the next logical step in any stealth design. Also seems to me that it would be ultra-top secret. Any thoughts? _________________________________________________ Tom Robison tcrobi@most.fw.hac.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:43:36 -0600 From: Brent Clark Subject: New Publication on the"Skunk Works" Since things have been slow, I thought I would add my 2 cents and give a heads up about a "new" Skunk Works" read. Airtime Publishing, which does an outstanding job of covering Military Aviation both modern and historic, is in the process of working on a soon to be realized work on the Lockheed Advanced Development works. Due out later this year. See reference http://www.airpower.co.uk/books/future.html Just something to look forward to. Brent ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:37:06 -0700 From: "A.J. Craddock" Subject: 2 "UCO's" spotted during "Star Wars" test The following is excerpted from "Aviation Week & Space Technology" issue of June 8th, 1998 (Vol. 148, No. 23), Page 57 It deals with Raytheon's January 16th space test of an Exo-atmospheric Kill Vechicle (EKV) sensor platform for a "Star Wars" type system. The sensor successfully detected the 9 targets (8 decoys and one genuine target) as well as the Lockheed-Martin Multi-Service Launch System (the "bus") which boosted the 9 test targets into orbit. But the Raytheon space sensor detected a total of 12 objects in all, so some other "things" were apparently hanging around. WEAPONS ENGINEERING Data Boost Confidence In Kill Vehicle Performance William B. Scott/ Colorado Springs One of the remaining three objects was a Lockheed Martin Astronautics Multi-Service Launch System (MSLS), which lofted nine conical- and spherical-shaped targets into space. The other two sensor-detected items could only be described as "unidentified celestial objects," according to Raytheon officials, who would not speculate on what they might be. More importantly, the "real" RV was identified and tracked successfully. End quote This is also summarized on CSETI's Website at http://www.cseti.org Tony Craddock ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 08:41:09 EDT From: CatshotKim@aol.com Subject: The Vice-President's plane is missing? In response to Tom Robison's post regarding AF2's dropping off radar: According to news reports, what disappeared from ATC's radar screens was the box of identifying data on AF2- things like ID, altitude, heading, etc. The ARTCC radars continued to get a "skin bounce" off the VP's aircraft. The problem was attributed to software. Given the complexity and age of the FAA's equipment I can certainly believe that. While I'm sure presidential aircraft are equipped with ECM to defeat missile threats, I doubt that a device to "zero out" an airliner's skin bounce has been developed. Yet. Kim Keller ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 10:17:45 +0000 From: patrick wiggins Subject: A skunk? Long time lurker mode off... The current (15 JUN 98) issue of Aviation Week carries an ad on page 7 from LockMart about VentureStar. The thing that caught my eye was down at the bottom of the page. There are shown the logos of everyone involved (Allied Signal, Goodrich, Boeing, Sverdrup, NASA) and then to the right of all that is a simple cartoon drawing of a skunk. A closer look found the same symbol on the vertical stabilizers of the X-33 pictured in the ad. I'm guessing the skunk is meant to indicate the involvement of the Skunk Works. True? If so, would any of you happen to know if the skunk really is their *official* logo? Back to lurker mode, Patrick :-) - -- Patrick Wiggins Hansen Planetarium Education Department email: p.wiggins@m.cc.utah.edu voice: 801.531-4952, fax: 801.531-4948 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 19:30:20 From: win@writer.win-uk.net (David) Subject: Re: A skunk? >Patrick Wiggins asked: >............ would any of you happen to know if the skunk >really is their *official* logo? Yes it is. I seem to remember being told by Lockeheed that after years of LADC tolerating the 'Skunk Works' tag, the decision was taken to adopt it officially. A case of 'if you can't beat 'em...' :) D ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 98 15:29:41 EDT From: keller@eos.ncsu.edu Subject: Re: A skunk? In response to Patrick, Dave wrote: >>Patrick Wiggins asked: >>............ would any of you happen to know if the skunk >>really is their *official* logo? >Yes it is. I seem to remember being told by Lockeheed that after years of >LADC tolerating the 'Skunk Works' tag, the decision was taken to adopt it >officially. A case of 'if you can't beat 'em...' :) I thought that Ben Rich's book had something to say about this. I have of copy of the book at home, but I'm at work right now, so this is from memory, maybe someone with the book handy can confirm/deny or elaborate on it. At any rate, yes, I believe that Lockheed did obtain trademark and/or copyright protection on both the skunk and the name "Skunk-Works" sometime ago, maybe in the 1970s. I thought I read in Ben Rich's book that the rationale for seeking legal protection for the skunk and the name "Skunk-Works" was purely a commercial business decision--the name skunk-works name was becoming known, other people were starting to pilfer the name, Lockheed felt that it was worth money to them, and it's existance wasn't really a secret anymore, anyway, so they decided to have it legally protected for themselves. - --Paul Keller ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 14:23:22 -0600 (MDT) From: Richard Wetz Subject: Re: A skunk? > In response to Patrick, Dave wrote: > >>Patrick Wiggins asked: > > >>............ would any of you happen to know if the skunk > >>really is their *official* logo? > > >Yes it is. I seem to remember being told by Lockeheed that after years of > >LADC tolerating the 'Skunk Works' tag, the decision was taken to adopt it > >officially. A case of 'if you can't beat 'em...' :) > > I thought that Ben Rich's book had something to say about this. I > have of copy of the book at home, but I'm at work right now, so this > is from memory, maybe someone with the book handy can confirm/deny or > elaborate on it. As I am sure you all know, the name was originally the "Skonk Works," which was the name of Injun Joe's backwoods still in Andy Capp's cartoon Lil Abner. According to Ben Rich's book: "In 1960, Capp's publisher objected to our use of Skonk Works, so we changed it to the Skunk Works and registered the name and logo as trademarks" (p. 112). So, yes, this is the official logo, and it has been in place since 1960. Rich ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 22:56:33 -0600 From: Brent Clark Subject: X-Planes Publication Just another reference to a publication which may be of interest to readers of this group. This one is from England. I just sent for one so I can neither confirm or deny its accuracy. See reference at http://www.keymags.co.uk/afm/xplanes.html Brent ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 01:14:52 -0700 From: tonydinkel@clubnet.net (Tony Dinkel) Subject: Re: A skunk? It was the only publicly visible marking on their building in Palmdale until recently. I miss it. td >>Patrick Wiggins asked: > >>............ would any of you happen to know if the skunk >>really is their *official* logo? > >Yes it is. I seem to remember being told by Lockeheed that after years of >LADC tolerating the 'Skunk Works' tag, the decision was taken to adopt it >officially. A case of 'if you can't beat 'em...' :) > >D ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 15:25:46 -0700 (PDT) From: David Lednicer Subject: Interesting I just had an interesting experience. Yesterday, an elderly man called my office and wanted to meet and discuss an airplane he was designing. When he showed up, he said his name was Dick Scherrer. This began to ring a bell. In our discussions, he mentioned working at NASA Ames, so I asked him where else he had worked. When he mentioned Lockheed, bells began to go off in my head - and then it dawned on me, this is THE Dick Scherrer who designed the Have Blue XST and indeed it was! I ended up spending another hour pumping him for stories about this effort and his involvement with the initial design of the B-2. He really is an interesting guy. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- David Lednicer | "Applied Computational Fluid Dynamics" Analytical Methods, Inc. | email: dave@amiwest.com 2133 152nd Ave NE | tel: (425) 643-9090 Redmond, WA 98052 USA | fax: (425) 746-1299 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1982 14:36:13 +1200 (NZST) From: Kerry Ferrand Subject: Lockheed photos Lockheed has opened a new photo server online. Ive just looked at it for a few minutes..some interesting stuff in the artwork/concepts sections etc (60's blackbird-ish "reusable aeropace passenger transport" for example) http://www.photos.external.lmco.com K ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Jun 1998 15:11:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Wei-Jen Su Subject: test (ignore me) Test May the Force be with you Wei-Jen Su E-mail: wsu@cco.caltech.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 11:29:07 -0600 From: gregd@cambertx.com Subject: Upcoming Skunk Works Book I cut'n'pasted this from the World Air Power Journal web site (http://www.airpower.co.uk/books/future.html) about an upcoming publication: Skunk Works America's most secret aircraft projects of the post-war era were designed and built as 'black' projects at the secret 'Skunk Works' site. Previously classified photographs and material on aircraft such as the U-2 and SR-71 Blackbird spyplanes, and the F-117 'Stealth Fighter', are combined with an exhaustive guide to the development of the site and the aircraft it produced. Each programme is traced from the drawing board through test and development phases to operational and service life. Accounts of test flying from the secret 'Area 51' base and the subsequent classified missions which have been shrouded in secrecy are comprehensively detailed, producing the definitive work on these infamous 'black' aircraft. Full development histories of Lockheed's clandestine projects; Technical drawings of every variant; Colour 3-view artworks; Details of secret operations revealed; Many previously classified photographs; Accounts of test flying; Methods of operation and specialised equipment; Full listings of every operator. Editors: C. Pocock and Robert F. Dorr Extent: 256 pages (hardbound) Scheduled publication date: December 1998 BTW Andreas, have you received WAPJ Vol.33 yet? I'm still waiting... Greg %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Reality is for People Who Can't Handle Simulation Greg Fieser 06/23/98 gregd@cambertx.com 11:29:08 (aka habu@cyberramp.net) %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% ------------------------------ End of skunk-works-digest V7 #31 ********************************