From: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com (skunk-works-digest) To: skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Subject: skunk-works-digest V7 #73 Reply-To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com Sender: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Errors-To: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Precedence: bulk skunk-works-digest Friday, November 13 1998 Volume 07 : Number 073 Index of this digest by subject: *************************************************** Re: Humour and the Govt would ... Beyond The Horizon : The Lockheed Story F-117 Test flights RE: F-117 Test flights Thank You (Off-Topic) Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) MicroStar Re: MicroStar Re: MicroStar Re: MicroStar Aeronautics Seminar Series (fwd) FWD: (SWA) Aviation Archaeology FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted F-117 / AF News *************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 02:32:51 GMT From: georgek@netwrx1.com (George R. Kasica) Subject: Re: Humour and the Govt would ... On Wed, 4 Nov 1998 21:07:09 -0500, you wrote: >Wrote: Dennis Lapcewich, Wednesday, November 04, 1998 5:15 PM >---------- >For example, if you told Navy personnel to "secure a building," they would turn >off the lights and lock the doors. >------------------ > >... And the Government would change the locks on all the doors after doing an IRS Tax Audit on the company that was in it ... > >-Martin Martin: In the future PLEASE do not send attachments to the skunk-works mailing list. Majordomo (the list software) and MANY mailers do not know how to handle them and it causes great problems for the users and the list. Thank you, ===[George R. Kasica]=== +1 414 541 8579 Skunk-Works ListOwner +1 800 816 2568 FAX http://www.netwrx1.com West Allis, WI USA ICQ #12862186 Digest Issues at: http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 08:09:13 -0800 From: G&G Subject: Beyond The Horizon : The Lockheed Story I found this title on amazon.com, has anyone read this book? Recommended? Panned? Comments? Beyond The Horizon : The Lockheed Story by Walter J. Boyne Greg Fieser ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 06:16:05 -0500 From: John Stone Subject: F-117 Test flights Hello, For all you F-117 fans the Skunk Works News Paper published a list of first flights for YF-117 test aircraft and pilots that flew test flights. This was in the October 1998 issue.... Here goes.... First Test aircraft flights.... #780 June 18, 1981 Hal Farley #781 Sept. 24, 1981 Dave Ferguson #782 Dec. 18, 1981 Tom Morgenfeld #783 July 7, 1982 Tom Morgenfeld #784 April 10, 1981 Bob Riedenauer First flights in YF-117 aircraft.... Major Tom Abel March 3, 1982 #782 Skip Anderson July 28, 1981 #780 Major Pete Barnes July 9, 1982 #784 Capt. John Beesley March 3, 1982 #780 Hal Farley June 18, 1981 #780 Dave Ferguson Aug. 1, 1981 #780 Skip Holm Aug. 31, 1982 #782 Major Dale Irving May 13, 1983 #782 Major Denny Mangum Aug. 24, 1982 #784 Tom Morgenfeld Nov. 20, 1981 #780 Lt. Col. Roger Mosley Dec. 1, 1981 #780 Bob Reidenauer April 7, 1982 #782 Lt. Col. Paul Tackabury June 19, 1982 #784 And the first operational USAF pilot was: Major Al Whitley I've not seen this before on the list hopefully I'm not duplicating a previous post. Best, John John Stone PLEASE NOTE NEW EMAIL ADDRESS: blkbirds@macol.net U-2 & SR-71 Web page: http://www.thepoint.net/~jstone/blackbird.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1998 06:52:28 -0500 From: Martin Hurst Subject: RE: F-117 Test flights - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0C76.B0E00C20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey John, good to hear from you again. Your webpage still has the old email address, jstone@thepoint.net Is this the correct one as well? John wrote: PLEASE NOTE NEW EMAIL ADDRESS: blkbirds@macol.net U-2 & SR-71 Web page: http://www.thepoint.net/~jstone/blackbird.html - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0C76.B0E00C20 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IiALAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAENgAQAAgAAAAIAAgABBJAG ADABAAABAAAADAAAAAMAADADAAAACwAPDgAAAAACAf8PAQAAAE0AAAAAAAAAgSsfpL6jEBmdbgDd AQ9UAgAAAABza3Vuay13b3Jrc0BuZXR3cngxLmNvbQBTTVRQAHNrdW5rLXdvcmtzQG5ldHdyeDEu Y29tAAAAAB4AAjABAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgADMAEAAAAYAAAAc2t1bmstd29ya3NAbmV0d3J4 MS5jb20AAwAVDAEAAAADAP4PBgAAAB4AATABAAAAGgAAACdza3Vuay13b3Jrc0BuZXR3cngxLmNv bScAAAACAQswAQAAAB0AAABTTVRQOlNLVU5LLVdPUktTQE5FVFdSWDEuQ09NAAAAAAMAADkAAAAA CwBAOgEAAAACAfYPAQAAAAQAAAAAAAADATsBCIAHABgAAABJUE0uTWljcm9zb2Z0IE1haWwuTm90 ZQAxCAEEgAEAFwAAAFJFOiBGLTExNyBUZXN0IGZsaWdodHMAzgYBBYADAA4AAADOBwsACgAGADQA HAACAEIBASCAAwAOAAAAzgcLAAoABgA0ABwAAgBCAQEJgAEAIQAAAEQ3RTRCNjMxNjc3OEQyMTE5 NkEyNDQ0NTUzNTQwMDAwAMgGAQOQBgAQAwAAEgAAAAsAIwABAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAQAAAAMA NgAAAAAAQAA5AMChMJegDL4BHgBwAAEAAAAXAAAAUkU6IEYtMTE3IFRlc3QgZmxpZ2h0cwAAAgFx AAEAAAAWAAAAAb4MoJcnMbbk2nhnEdKWokRFU1QAAAAAHgAeDAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8M AQAAABYAAABtYXJ0aW5oQGl4Lm5ldGNvbS5jb20AAAADAAYQXlz+IgMABxDgAAAAHgAIEAEAAABl AAAASEVZSk9ITixHT09EVE9IRUFSRlJPTVlPVUFHQUlOWU9VUldFQlBBR0VTVElMTEhBU1RIRU9M REVNQUlMQUREUkVTUyxKU1RPTkVAVEhFUE9JTlRORVRJU1RISVNUSEVDT1JSRQAAAAACAQkQAQAA AJQBAACQAQAAhQIAAExaRnXR5EjT/wAKAQ8CFQKoBesCgwBQAvIJAgBjaArAc2V0MjcGAAbDAoMy A8UCAHByQnER4nN0ZW0CgzN3AuQHEwKAfQqACM8J2TvxFg8yNTUCgAqBDbELYOBuZzEwMxRQCwoU UQUL8mMAQCBIZXkgAEpvaG4sIGdvgQRwIHRvIGhlCsGJA1IgeQhgIGFnC3EKLgqFWQhhIHdlYvEK sGdlIBPAAxADIBGA9QQgdBwQIAbwG8AT4AtwsQMgYWRkFhAEECwKhSZqE8ACIGVAHzFwb2kLgHQu IUB0CoUKhUnfHxIEAB8jBaEWEGMFQCEx7xzgBCAeEB7APyI8GzIeAPsDYBPQOgqHGesTUCZhJCFA UExFQVNFB7BPAlQo0UVXIEVNQQRJTBSwRERSRVOIUzogAmBrYmkLIPxzQADBBvAh8hnPGtAnDyko FVUtEeAmBgBSLWo3GtBXHiAgHkImlmhBAkBwOi8vdzBwLukhei9+IQQvAmAA0CqT+i4wAG0V8Cuv J/cKhRUxAgA1QAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAAAAABAAAcwYPCMPaAMvgFAAAgwwKEwl6AMvgEeAD0AAQAA AAUAAABSRTogAAAAAO7A - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE0C76.B0E00C20-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 12:37:54 +1030 From: Dennis Lapcewich Subject: Thank You (Off-Topic) To those of you on this list who have a first person understanding of the eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month, thank you. Of the original 331,781 in Australia, only 66 are still alive on this 80th anniversary. Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 98 11:35:24 -0500 From: gregweigold@pmsc.com Subject: Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) As the man said, To all the Vets, Thank you. To the families and loved ones of those who made the ultimate sacrifice, Our thoughts and prayers are with you at this time of remembrance. Greg W. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 00:19:22 GMT From: georgek@netwrx1.com (George R. Kasica) Subject: Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) On Wed, 11 Nov 98 11:35:24 -0500, you wrote: > >As the man said, > >To all the Vets, Thank you. > >To the families and loved ones of those who made the ultimate sacrifice, Our >thoughts and prayers are with you at this time of remembrance. > >Greg W. Well Said Greg! Thank you to ALL who have served. George George, MR. Tibbs & The Beast Kasica West Allis, WI USA http://www.netwrx1.com ICQ #12862186 Zz zZ |\ z _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' _ ;-;;,_ |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'_' '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1998 17:19:22 +0000 From: patrick wiggins Subject: Re: Thank You (Off-Topic) Consider this a salute from someone who was a "blue-suiter" for 26 years. Dennis Lapcewich wrote: > To those of you on this list who have a first person understanding of the > eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month, thank you. Patrick - -- Patrick Wiggins Hansen Planetarium Education Department email: p.wiggins@m.cc.utah.edu voice: 801.531-4952, fax: 801.531-4948 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 03:19:34 -0500 From: "Frank Markus" Subject: MicroStar Whaat has the Skunk Works been up to lately? At least part of the answer is provided in an article entitled "Miniature Air Vehicles Fly Into Army's Future" by David A. Fulgham in the November 9 issue of Aviation Week. The MicroStar is a "6-in.-long, 3 oz. micro air vehicle designed to collect intelligence from a few hundred feet." It first flew in August. It can fly up to 3 miles at 30 mph. Its cruising altitude is roughly 150-200 feet but it can fly as high as 500. It carries a camera but could also perform other tasks such as jamming and targeting. There is a photograph of the MicroStar with the article but it does not clearly show a propeller or any other means of propulsion. (This reminded me of the first pictures of the B-2 and the F117A which also avoided showing key features.) There is something that might be a single flat propeller blade at the rear of the fuselage. This object appears to have staight edges and a cropped (squared off) tip and does not seem to have the twist that most propellers have. The machine is described as having a "stealthy electric engine." There is also a mention that "advanced micro internal combustion engines are being developed." The photograph of the MicroStar shows it resting on a wireframe drawing of itself. There might be a cylindrical motor shown inside the fuselage with a shaft running aft as might be expected in a aircraft with a pusher propeller. There is also a second cylinder inside which might just be a battery. The wings have a swept-back leading edge. (Why would this make sense in a machine that is intended to fly at 30 mph?) The general shape of the wings is like a delta with the ends cropped off about halfway between the base and the tip. The long wingtips are "cut" flat, that is, like the "propeller" they are not tapered or faired. The shape of the wings reminded me of the F-22. The wing section appears to be very flat. (Again, isn't a wing with low curvature more appropriate for high speed flight?) The wings do not appear to be faired into the body; there is a distinct edge where the wing meets the body. Unlike the wings, the fuselage is entirely curved without any apparent flat areas, edges or constant curves. The tail fin's shape appears very similar to that of the wings -- only smaller. I assume that the use of parallel edges is for stealth. I hope that others on the list with a better aeronautical vocabulary can improve on my description -- and answer the questions that I raised about this machine. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 04:10:45 -0500 (EST) From: Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl Subject: Re: MicroStar Two minor corrections in regard to Frank's post about the Lockheed MicroStar. The MicroStar is not a Skunk Works product, but was developed by Sanders, a Lockheed Martin Company, and the 'photo' in the AW&ST is 'just' a computer graphic, which accounts for the reduced detail and may not be 100% accurate. See also the new Popular Mechanics (December 1998, page 26). - -- Andreas - --- --- Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl E-Mail: schnars@ais.org 313 West Court St. #305 or: gpahl@acm.flint.umich.edu Flint, MI 48502-1239 Tel: (810) 238-8469 WWW URL: http://www.ais.org/~schnars/ - --- --- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 05:23:03 -0800 From: patrick Subject: Re: MicroStar At 03:19 AM 11/12/98 -0500, you wrote: > Whaat has the Skunk Works been up to lately? At least part of the answer >is provided in an article entitled "Miniature Air Vehicles Fly Into Army's >Future" by David A. Fulgham in the November 9 issue of Aviation Week. > > > I hope that others on the list with a better aeronautical vocabulary can >improve on my description -- and answer the questions that I raised about >this machine. > > >Isn't it also possible that they simply built a 6 inch RC airplane using off the shelf electric motors used by hobbyists? patrick cullumber ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 10:25:20 -0800 (PST) From: Wei-Jen Su Subject: Re: MicroStar On Thu, 12 Nov 1998, Frank Markus wrote: > The wings have a swept-back leading edge. (Why would this make sense in a > machine that is intended to fly at 30 mph?) The general shape of the wings Most probably for stability reason. > shape appears very similar to that of the wings -- only smaller. I assume > that the use of parallel edges is for stealth. As you mention already, another reason may be for stealth signature. Edges must be parallel. May the Force be with you Wei-Jen Su E-mail: wsu@cco.caltech.edu "Physics is like sex, you have to do it with someone or you will call it something else..." Richard Feynman 1965 Physics Nobel Laureate ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 13:55:25 -0800 (PST) From: Wei-Jen Su Subject: Aeronautics Seminar Series (fwd) Well, I mentioned this talk before, but just in case no one here know about Mr. Robert J. Gilliland, here is the abstract. And again, it is free to general public. May the Force be with you Wei-Jen Su E-mail: wsu@cco.caltech.edu "Physics is like sex, you have to do it with someone or you will call it something else..." Richard Feynman 1965 Physics Nobel Laureate - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 10:53:02 -0800 (PST) From: Ioannis Chasiotis To: aerodirectory@galcit.caltech.edu Subject: Aeronautics Seminar Series Hi everybody, This Monday's (November 16) Aeronautics Seminar will be presented by: Mr. Robert J. Gilliland Retired Experimental Test Pilot Lockheed Martin Skunk Works The topic is: "Test Flying The World's Fastest Airplanes" and it is scheduled as always at 1:00 p.m. at 306 Firestone Mr.Gilliland will be at Caltech for lunch at Athenaeum with faculty members of Aeronautics and graduate students at 12:00 before the talk. Any of you (faculty or students) who would like to meet Mr. Gilliland and have lunch with us please let me know by Monday morning (November 16) so that I can make the necessary reservation. The students that do not have a membership at Athenaeum can charge their lunch to their account for material transfer in the department by simply providing their S.S.N. An abstract of Mr. Gilliland's talk and more information about the SR-71 can be found at: http://www.its.caltech.edu/~ichasiot/html/fall.html An extended abstract follows. _________________________________________________________________________ ABSTRACT Mr. Bob Gilliland was the Lockheed's project test pilot for the SR-71 BLACKBIRD and the first to fly that aircraft (Dec. 22, 1964). His talk will cover inception, design, technical, operational, and political aspects of that aircraft, which currently holds the high-altitude world speed record. He will also discuss the F-104 STARFIGHTER, which holds the low-altitude world speed record. He will give a "look ahead", touching upon the F-117 STEALTH and the ATF (YF-22). Mr. Gilliland has logged more supersonic flying time above Mach 2 & 3 than any other pilot and was named "Top Test Pilot" by the Society of Experimental Test Pilots. _________________________________________________________________________ For more information please feel free to contact me. Ioannis Chasiotis, Aeronautics Seminar Chairman Department of Aeronautics (GALCIT), 205-45 California Institute of Technology Tel.(Office) : (626) 395-4744 E-mail : ichasiot@cco.caltech.edu URL : http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~ichasiot ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 16:36:40 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: FWD: (SWA) Aviation Archaeology Alternate subject: Bulletin 25 - Evaluating and Documenting Aviation Properties Some discussion over the years about recovering F-117A fragments from crash sites was never really resolved or else my CRS (can't remember stuff) is kicking in again. Terry - ---------------------- [ AzTeC / SWA SASIG ] : From: Craig Fuller aair@juno.com The latest e-mail [discussing aviation archaeology, Wall Street Journal, November 11, 1998] does not paint a good picture of the hobby. I know two of the individuals mentioned and they are not the treasure hunters the article makes them sound like. But there are a number of those types out there. Doug Scroggins, one of the people named, is pulling the strings together to set up the first museum dedicated to the history of aircraft mishaps: < http://www.lostbirds.com/News/index.htm > If you will visit my web site and go to the "Crash of the Month" you will see information on my trip to Fort Irwin. We located a crash site for a (indirect) relative of the pilot. We went out to the site with the base archaeologist who is going to register the site with the CA SHPO. I have yet to see Bulletin 25, but below is a review that I was forwarded today. Craig Fuller Aviation Archaeological Investigation & Research (AAIR) < http://www.sonic.net/azfuller > The United States Department of the Interior's National Park Service has published a National Register Bulletin entitled "Guidelines for Evaluating and Documenting Historic Aviation Properties." You can order your very own copy for free by calling the National Register reference desk at (202) 343-8012 or via e-mail at nr_reference@nps.gov. This fifty-four page booklet has a history only slightly less tortured than that of the 1781 Articles of Confederation and is about as useful. The first draft, released for comment in early 1995, brought a storm of criticism from virtually every corner of the aviation historical community - - including TIGHAR. In "Your Tax Dollars At Work" (TIGHAR Tracks Vol. 11, No. 3) we expressed our misgivings about the draft but vowed to do our best to help correct the problems. After many hours of donated work and face-to-face meetings in Washington, we ultimately concluded that the National Register of Historic Places was simply not an appropriate tool for protecting historic airplanes (see "Great Hammer, Lousy Screwdriver" Vol. 11, No. 4). No revised draft was ever circulated and the issue seemed to be mercifully dead. But a federally funded project is the only example of true immortality known to science and, three years later, "Guidelines for Evaluating and Documenting Historic Aviation Properties" appeared unheralded in the mailbox. In all fairness, it's not as bad as the initial draft and where it discusses conventional properties - buildings, structures, archaeological sites, etc. - its advice is unremarkable. A superfluous section purporting to tell the story of "Aviation In American History" is merely shallow and poorly proofed rather than being biased and inaccurate. For example: "Goddard (Robert H., that is) undertook research during WWI that led to the development of a solid- projectile, which was used during WWII as the bazooka." Make that "solid- propellant." Some of the errors are pretty basic. Throughout the booklet "hangar" is rarely spelled correctly. But it is in attempting to explain what airplanes are eligible for nomination to the National Register of Historic Places that the bulletin wanders from the obtuse to the hilarious. In a section entitled "Evaluating the Integrity of Historic Aviation Properties" it carefully states that "a property must retain the key materials from its period of its significance" (sic) and that "a property whose historic features and materials have been lost and then reconstructed is usually not eligible." So far so good, but then the bulletin goes on to explain that, because airplanes have various parts replaced during their service life, "As long as an aircraft retains the majority of its structural members, it should be considered the authentic aircraft." So it looks like your J-3 Cub, re-engined and re-covered in 1998 and equipped with the latest avionics, is eligible for the National Register so long as most of its steel tube skeleton dates from the old days. But wait. "Setting" - defined as "the physical environment of a historic property" - is a crucial factor in eligibility. The aircraft must be "in a setting which is appropriate to an aircraft and allows it to convey its significance as an aircraft. An example of an appropriate setting would be an air-related facility where the aircraft is maintained." That means your historic 1998 J-3 Cub with the 1938 skeleton may be eligible for the National Register if you keep it down at the airport and not someplace weird like a museum. "The National Register generally excludes museum objects from being listed" because "museum objects do not have integrity of location and setting.." even though all six (that's right, six) of the intact aircraft now on the Register are in museums. But - but sometimes a museum is not a museum. For example: the bulletin points out that the Hughes Hercules flying boat, although protected in a museum-like setting, still qualifies for the Register because it is "located in Long Beach, California, the site of its successful air tests." The fact that the Spruce Goose was sold and removed to Oregon years ago seems to have escaped the National Park Service. In the end, "Guidelines for Evaluating and Documenting Historic Aviation Properties" could well serve as a bible for those who want the distinction of having an airplane listed on the National Register because, as with Holy Scripture, in its pages one can find justification for almost anything. - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean@primenet.com > Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/8832 Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: http://www.seacoast.com/~jsweet/brotherh/index.html Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 20:08:44 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted Forwarded "as is", and obligatory skunky stuff, the fellow does mention the F-117. BTW, anyone get the details of which and how many stealthy planes being deployed to SWA? Terry - ------------------ Firstly, for those who care, I am back from my trip to North Wales, weather was bad, and there were Sheep everywhere. Secondly, tonight at around 8:30pm GMT, I witnessed a craft come flying across the sky from the West (over the North Sea, I live in Beccles, Suffolk), it appeared to by similar to a delta wing in shape, to me it looked like a F-117, it was Quiet and fast, very bright with 6 white underlights, which remained on, and two red lights, which blinked, to the rear of the craft. I couldn't make out the exact shape at the back of it, but I saw enough to convince me it wasn't the usual civilian craft I sometimes see in the night sky (the front was prominently lit, but the rear was in shadow). It flew approx 2000ft up, and I must emphasise, that it was very Bright. The shape of the lights was as follows : O O O O O O The White lights at front. x x The red lights at back. Could anyone on the list tell me what it might be, or if any F-117 's are stationed in Britain..... any help at all would be appreciated. Thanks Spidey - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean@primenet.com > Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/8832 Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: http://www.seacoast.com/~jsweet/brotherh/index.html Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 03:29:15 +0000 From: John Szalay Subject: Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted At 08:08 PM 11/12/98 -0700, you wrote: >Forwarded "as is", and obligatory skunky stuff, the fellow does mention >the F-117. BTW, anyone get the details of which and how many stealthy >planes being deployed to SWA? > >Terry > 12 F-117 ( http://www.af.mil/news/Nov1998/n19981112_981734.html) Here is the list of "NEW" deployments. The additional forces ordered to deploy include an air expeditionary force of 12 F-16CJs, 12 F-15C's and -Ds, 12 F-16s and six B-1s. Besides the AEF, four additional F-16CJs, 12 F-117s, 12 B-52s, two EA-6B's and 12 Marine Corps F/A-18s have been ordered to the Gulf for a total of 84 combat aircraft. (http://www.af.mil/news/Nov1998/n19981112_981721.html) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 21:29:27 -0800 From: patrick Subject: Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted At 08:08 PM 11/12/98 -0700, you wrote: >Forwarded "as is", and obligatory skunky stuff, the fellow does mention >the F-117. BTW, anyone get the details of which and how many stealthy >planes being deployed to SWA? > >Suffolk), it appeared to by similar to a delta wing in shape, to me it >looked like a F-117, it was Quiet and fast, very bright with 6 white >underlights, which remained on, and two red lights, which blinked, to the >rear of the craft. > >The shape of the lights was as follows : > > O > O O > O O O The White >lights at front. > > x x The red >lights at back. > > >Could anyone on the list tell me what it might be, or if any F-117 's are >stationed in Britain..... any help at all would be appreciated. > It might not be an F-117. They only have 3 white lights which are a landing lights and are mounted one per strut in an obvious triangle pattern. There is a single red light near the nose on the bottom. No lights in the back. And if you say it was fast and quiet, I am convinced it wasn't an F-117. It is my understanding all F-117's are based at Holloman with the exception of the FSD aircraft at Palmdale (4). And air show season is over so forget that idea! patrick cullumber ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1998 23:58:22 -0800 From: Dan Zinngrabe Subject: Re: FWD: (UASR) Stealth/Unusual Plane Sighted Hmmm.... Now all those white lights on what we assume to be the leading edges- wasn't that more or less the concept behind some of the daylight visual stealth stuff making the rounds a year or two ago? It's a bit unusual to hear of a military aircraft with the leading edges lit like that. It would be kinda easy to track with a ZSU. Steve? Dan _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ lead, follow, or get out of the way. _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1998 09:16:20 +0100 From: "Stefan Dornbusch" Subject: F-117 / AF News Holloman unit to deploy to Southwest Asia Released: 12 Nov 1998 HOLLOMAN AIR FORCE BASE, N.M. (AFPN) -- The president has approved the recommendation of the secretary of defense to deploy additional forces to the gulf region. The forces approved, including about a dozen F-117s from the 49th Fighter Wing, are among those that were placed on contingency alert following the drawdown of U.S. forces from the gulf region last spring. "We're ready," said Brig. Gen. William J. Lake, 49th FW commander. "This is the fourth time we've been called upon since the end of the Gulf War. We deployed six F-117 Nighthawks in late 1996. We deployed six in late 1997, and another six in February of this year. We don't relish in the thought of sending our people into harm's way, but this is what we train and prepare for on a day-to-day basis at Holloman." During the Gulf War, F-117s flew about 1,300 sorties and scored direct hits on 1,600 highly defended, high priority targets. The F-117 was the only U.S. or allied aircraft to strike targets in downtown Baghdad. Not one of these aircraft sustained so much as a scratch in combat, and this is a far better aircraft today than it was in early 1991, said Lake. (Courtesy ACC News Service) ------------------------------ End of skunk-works-digest V7 #73 ******************************** To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe in the body of a message to "majordomo@netwrx1.com". 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