From: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com (skunk-works-digest) To: skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Subject: skunk-works-digest V9 #50 Reply-To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com Sender: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Errors-To: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Precedence: bulk skunk-works-digest Wednesday, July 19 2000 Volume 09 : Number 050 Index of this digest by subject: *************************************************** FWD (TLCB) Re: Air America RE: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook RE: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook RE: Aurora killed my Chinook... Re: > Aurora killed my Chinook... RE: Aurora killed my Chinook... Re: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook Lockheed AC-130A Hercules and C-130 Hercules McDonnell Douglas F-4G Phantom II "Wild Weasel V" Fairchild Republic A-10 Thunderbolt II Boeing KC-135 Stratotanker RE: Fairchild Republic A-10 Thunderbolt II *************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2000 22:38:26 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: FWD (TLCB) Re: Air America Go to: < http://www.abebooks.com > Do a search for "christopher robbins" or "Air America" It's a good start, the author also did "The Ravens" and in it appologizes several times for some liberties taken while writing the AirAm book. There's also the VDO that was done in Feb/March this year on the Discovery Channel, Birds of a Feather, Wings, series. Check the www site (or, Leigh, do you have the 1-800 # for ordering??). Can also check: http://www.google.com and search for "air america" Get a lot of unrelated www sites and info, but some good hits. Unfortunately, almost zip available on CASI, Bird, or Arizona Helicopters. Bill Leary, prof a the Univ of Georgia, is doing a definitive history of Air America, no idea when it'll be out, he's been working on it for several years. He also did PERLIOUS MISSIONS, a history of CAT, which evolved into Air America after Dien Bien Phu. Charlie Davis' book ACROSS THE MEKONG is also good, but covers his time out of Udorn flying in Laos, not Vietnam. Mac At 08:17 AM 07/12/2000 -0500, Marvin wrote: >The only helicopter group I ever heard of was the Flying Circus which >supported us. I finally have to show my ignorance and ask a really dumb >question: I don't think I ever heard of Air America, Continental Air >Services, Bird Helicopters, or Arizona Helicopters while in SEA. >What/where were they and what did they do? > >Thanks for the education. - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:03:15 +0100 From: "Gavin Payne" Subject: RE: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook I've been following that case for years as any bored English person has and all I can say is hmmmm! > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com > [mailto:owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com]On Behalf Of Terry W. Colvin > Sent: 12 July 2000 07:05 > To: iufo@topica.com; forteana@primenet.com > Subject: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook > > > A very interesting article about the RAF Chinook crash: > > < http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/11847.html > > > Dave > > -- > Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) > < fortean1@frontiernet.net > > Home Page: < > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * > TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 12:34:42 PDT From: "wayne binkley" Subject: RE: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook that story has so many holes in it it can not be taken seriously.i will point one out.i don't even need to look up the runway required to land a P-3 orion.it is a four engine turboprop with reversible props.i am sure it touches down no faster than 150 kts.it probably can use a 5-6,000 ft runway with no problem.it most certainly does not require a "3mile long runway"in an emergency it could land at most any military airfield.whoever wrote that article(about the aurora causing the RAF chinook to crash)apparently doesn't know jack s*** about aircraft wayne d.binkley - ----Original Message Follows---- From: "Gavin Payne" Reply-To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com To: Subject: RE: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 18:03:15 +0100 I've been following that case for years as any bored English person has and all I can say is hmmmm! > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com > [mailto:owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com]On Behalf Of Terry W. Colvin > Sent: 12 July 2000 07:05 > To: iufo@topica.com; forteana@primenet.com > Subject: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook > > > A very interesting article about the RAF Chinook crash: > > < http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/11847.html > > > Dave > > -- > Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) > < fortean1@frontiernet.net > > Home Page: < > http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * > TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program > ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 17:51:09 -0400 From: "Frank Markus" Subject: RE: Aurora killed my Chinook... I have several questions about this article. (1) Why is there nothing about the source of the illustration? To my eye it is not a photograph but, rather, an attempt to illustrate the contents of the story. It seems improbable that the refueling probe - or even the planes - would have been visible from the ground even with an extremely long lens. Or was there someone flying chase who released this picture but has never surfaced? (2) Don't classified aircraft usually fly at night when not over completely secured reservations of the sort that are available in the American Southwest or central Australia. I have been by the Machrihanish installation while driving around the Mull of Kintyre. It is rather close to the substantial community of Campbelltown. Even though the runway presumably would be approached exited from the sea, the waters near the base are heavily fished. It seems unlikely that a large (and loud) aircraft would not have been noticed and remarked upon. (3) Alien spacecraft. Need I say more. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com [mailto:owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com]On Behalf Of Wayne Turnbull Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2000 10:36 AM To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com Subject: Aurora killed my Chinook... If anyone's interested, here's a link for an imaginative explanation for the Mull of Kintyre Chinook crash a few years ago. www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/11847.html WT ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 10:17:29 +0930 From: Steve Apthorpe Subject: Re: > Aurora killed my Chinook... > A very interesting article about the RAF Chinook crash: > http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/11847.html This article is: a) evidence that stupid people can make money on the internet. b) someone on psychotropic drugs. c) hyper-reality. d) a ploy to divert attention away from Boscombe Down. e) all of the above. Email your answers to someone who gives a toss ... and then let me know when you find that person. Steve ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 10:29:34 +0930 From: Dennis Lapcewich Subject: RE: Aurora killed my Chinook... > I have several questions about this article. > - -- snip -- > (2) Don't classified aircraft usually fly at night when not > over completely > secured reservations of the sort that are available in the American > Southwest or central Australia. A headline article in The Australian newspaper earlier this week pointed out that there are severe deficiencies to coastal surveillance (air and sea), especially near the Top End of Australia. It is apparently now quite common for aircraft to enter Oz airspace unseen to pick up/drop off cargo, people, etc. Since this information has now finally made it to the mainstream media, it can only mean that the problem is so widespread, and the article may be a political attempt at funding to beef up security services. It looks like the crocodiles, snakes, spiders, tropics and deserts are no longer good enough to keep people out. Time to activate the kangaroos with Stingers, I guess ... :) Dennis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 10:01:47 +0100 From: "David" Subject: Re: FWD (UASR) Aurora and Chinook From: Terry W. Colvin > A very interesting article about the RAF Chinook crash: > > < http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/11847.html Oh dear - where to begin...The author hasn't cited the source of this 'new' information. I wonder why not ? The 'Aurora' was travelling at M8 a few miles from Mach ?!! Was it landing or taking off - Give me a break. I'd love to see its brake and propulsion system specs. See what you've done- I've coughed coffeee all over my keyboard :) I see they've used Bill Rose's mock-up of Chris Gibson's North Sea sighting in this article - N.B: Bill created this copyrighted image as an illustration of Chris's sighting- he has never suggested it was a real photograph - I hope they got his permission to use it. Chris was nowhere near Machrinhanish or even Scotland when he saw the mystery plane...nor did he have a camera - nor was he the only witness. He was called topside by a colleague to identify the a/c flying in formation. I can't be bothered to go on, other than to say the author would do well to talk to engineers involved in hypersonic a/c design to see what kind of problems are associated with building a M20 air breathing vehicle and the themodynamic issues involved with flying a plane at M8 so low that its shockwave would cause the tragedy cited. Out of respect for the crew and passengers who lost there lives out there, it would be good to draw a line under this fantasy. Best David ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 11:39:15 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: Lockheed AC-130A Hercules and C-130 Hercules Heavyweight fire The idea of the aerial gunship was revived by the Americans in the Vietnam War as a means of tackling guerrilla forces. Fitted with specialist sensors and guns along the port (left) side of the fuselage, the gunship was designed to orbit above the target and pour down a withering volume of fire. The concept was proved by AC-47 and AC-119 conversions of the obsolescent Douglas C-47 and Fairchild C-119 transports, and the U.S. Air Force then decided to develop a more capable conversion of the modern Hercules transport. Conversion program In 1965, the 13th C-130A was converted to AC-130A standard with improved sights and an armament of four 20-mm cannon and four 0.3-in (7.62-mm) Miniguns. This machine was evaluated in Vietnam during 1967, and paved the way for the conversion of seven JC-130A drone directors with improved sight arrangements that included a forward-looking infra-red target- acquisition system. The "Surprise Package" program involved one conversion with two 40-mm Bofors guns in place of the two 20-mm cannon and two Miniguns aft of the wing, and a laser designator added. This was so successful that nine more "Pave Pronto" conversions were effected to a standard including the "Black Crow" sensor for the detection of unshielded vehicle ignition systems. Principal version AC-130A (initial gunship conversions in two basic standards). Principal user USA. Technical data Type: Lockheed AC-130A Hercules multi-crew ground attack gunship. Engines: four 3,750-chp (2,796-kW) Allison T56-A-1A turboprops. Performance: maximum speed 380 mph (612 km/h) at 30,000 ft (9,145 m); initial climb rate not revealed; service ceiling 41,300 ft (12,590 m); endurance 5 hours 0 minutes. Weights: empty not revealed; maximum take-off 124,200 lb (56,336 kg). Dimensions: span 132 ft 7 in (40.41 m); length 97 ft 9 in (29.79 m); height 38 ft 3 in (11.66 m); wing area 1,745.0 sq ft (162.11 m^2). Armament: see text. =========================== C-130 Hercules Transport for the world To meet a U.S. Air Force Tactical Air Command requirement for a medium-weight transport capable of operating in and out of unprepared landing strips, a design competition was launched in 1951. Lockheed won and the C-130 prototype flew in August 1954. The high-wing airlifter was centered on a very spacious fuselage, with an access ramp at the rear that could be lowered in flight for air drops. Orders soared and the plane was in high-rate production for many years resulting in the 1,900th unit delivered in 1988, with production continuing at three a month. At the beginning of 1990 the C-130 was still in production, and in service with the air forces of 61 countries. Success and variations The first batch of 219 C-130As began to enter TAC service in December 1956, and was followed by 242 C-130Bs. Work began in 1961 on the C-130E model for Military Airlift Command, and 488 were built through 1975. The C-130H version, with more powerful engines, saw 297 for the U.S. Air Force and Navy plus over 500 for other countries. Roles and missions It seems that the C-130 has performed every mission possible for a transport plane, from cargo carrier to flying hospital, as well as unusual tasks such as the aerial recovery of spy satellite films. The type has been fitted out as a gunship, electronic warfare platform and in-flight-refueling tanker, and there are even ski-fitted models for supply in the Antarctic, operating through New Zealand. Principal versions C-130A (initial production version), C-130B (payload improvement); C-130E (more payload for MAC); C-130H (more powerful engines, new avionics); C-130K (UK model of H); C-130H-30 (stretched); KC-130F (aerial tanker). Principal users Australia, Brazil, Canada, Egypt, Great Britain, Morocco, Saudi Arabia, and USA. Technical data Type: C-130H five-crew tactical transport plane. Engines: four 4,508-chp (2,796-kw) Allison T56-A-15 turboprops. Performance: maximum speed 384 mph (618 km/h) at 30,000 ft (9,145 m); initial climb rate 1,900 ft (579 m) per minute; service ceiling 42,900 ft (13,075 m); range 2,487 miles (4,002 km) with maximum payload. Weights: empty 76,470 lb (34,687 kg); maximum take-off 175,000 lb (79,380 kg). Dimensions: span 132 ft 7 in (40.41 m); length 97 ft 9 in (29.79 m); height 38 ft 3 in (11.66 m); wing area 1,745.0 sq ft (162.12 m^2). Payload: 92 troops, or 64 paratroops, or 42,645 lb (19,344 kg) of freight. - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 11:49:47 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: McDonnell Douglas F-4G Phantom II "Wild Weasel V" The "Wild Weasel" role Modern air operations can only be undertaken effectively if the enemy's air-defence radars are located and destroyed, and in American terminology this role is called "Wild Weasel". "Wild Weasel" aircraft came to the fore in the Vietnam War, and culminated in the "Wild Weasel IV" conversion of about 12 F-4C fighters. It then became clear that larger numbers of better equipped aircraft were needed. This resulted in the development of the F-4G "Wild Weasel V", of which 116 were produced as F-4E conversions. Much revised equipment The main changes were the elimination of the internal 20-mm cannon and the installation of the McDonnell Douglas APR-38 radar homing and warning system with most of its receiver aerials in a fintop housing. This system detects enemy radars and then analyzes, classifies, and locates them before giving the rear-seater a priority list of radars for destruction with the specialized weapons carried by the F-4G (AGM-45 Shrike and AGM-88 HARM anti-radar missiles) or the conventional weapons of its escorting F-4E. Principal version F-4G Phantom II (anti-radar model). Principal user USA. Technical data Type: McDonnell Douglas F-4G Phantom II two-seat anti-radar warplane. Engines: two 17,900-lb (8,117-kg) afterburning thrust General Electric J79-GE-17 turbojets. Performance: maximum speed 1,485 mph (2,390 km/h) or Mach 2.25 at 40,000 ft (12,190 m); initial climb rate not revealed; service ceiling 62,250 ft (18,975 m); radius 595 miles (985 km). Weights: empty 29,321 lb (13,300 kg); maximum take-off 62,390 lb (28,300 kg). Dimensions: span 38 ft 5 in (11.71 m); length 63 ft 0 in (19.20 m); height 16 ft 5.5 in (5.02 m); wing area 530.0 sq ft (49.24 m^2). Armament: two AIM-9 Sparrow air-to-air missiles and a mix of AGM-45 Shrike, AGM-65 Maverick, and AGM-88 HARM air-to-surface missiles. - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 12:04:37 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: Fairchild Republic A-10 Thunderbolt II Competitive fly-off In 1967 the U.S. Air Force launched a program for a subsonic tactical support warplane able to carry a large warload in the primary anti-tank role. Prototypes were ordered from Fairchild Republic and Northrop, the former's YA-10A first flying in May 1972. The YA-10A was evaluated competitively against the YA-9A, and declared winner of the competition in 1973. Tank buster The Thunderbolt II was designed as a low-cost type, and therefore lacks all-weather capability and relies on the pilot's head-up display for accurate weapon delivery. Total production was 723 aircraft designed specifically to survive against Soviet battlefield air defenses and knock out Soviet armor. Survivability was provided by widely separated engines, a titanium armor bath for the pilot and primary systems. Offensive capability was provided by the GAU-8/A Avenger seven-barrel cannon firing depleted uranium projectiles, and a large load of varied ordnance (including six Maverick air-to-surface missiles) carried under the fuselage and wings. Despite the type's protective features and low-level agility, there are now serious doubts about the A-10A's survivability because of its very low speed and comparatively large size.** Principal version A-10A Thunderbolt II (sole production version). Principal user USA. Technical data Type: Fairchild Republic A-10A Thunderbolt II single-seat tactical support and anti-tank warplane. Engines: two 9,065-lb (4,111-kg) thrust General Electric TF-34-GE-100 turbofans. Performance: maximum speed 439 mph (706 km/h) at sea level; initial climb rate 6,000 ft (1,830 m) per minute; service ceiling not revealed; radius 288 miles (463 km) with a loiter of 1 hour 42 minutes. Weights: empty 24,960 lb (11,322 kg); maximum take-off 50,000 lb (22,680 kg). Dimensions: span 57 ft 6 in (17.53 m); length 53 ft 4 in (16.26 m); height 14 ft 8 in (4.47 m); wing area 506.0 sq ft (47.01 m^2). Armament: one 30-mm multi-barrel cannon and up to 16,000 lb (7,258 kg) of disposable stores. **Desert Storm postscript: This information card was written before the proven Warthog success in Desert Storm. The Iraqi armor, artillery, and support vehicles were devastated by A-10 firepower. The niggling question remains of how well the A-10 would do in an offensive mode against a better prepared enemy in the forests and plains of Europe or elsewhere. [TWC] - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 12:42:41 -0700 From: "Terry W. Colvin" Subject: Boeing KC-135 Stratotanker A refueler for the U.S. Air Force In August 1954 the USAF chose a derivative of the Model 387-80 prototype as replacement for its Boeing KC-97 tanker. The first KC-135 flew in August 1956, and deliveries of 732 aircraft began in June 1957. The KC-135 has a narrower fuselage than the Model 707 airliner derived from the same prototype, and a different interior including the tanks that feed the Boeing "flying boom" refueling system. Good beyond the year 2020 In the early 1990s there are still more than 640 of these valuable aircraft in service. The fleet is being slowly but steadily improved in two programs for a continued operational viability into the next century. The designation KC-135E covers Air Force Reserve and Air National Guard aircraft modified with reskinned wing under surfaces as well as the tail units, anti-skid brakes, and Pratt & Whitney JT3D-3B turbofans (plus their pylons and nacelles) removed from surplus Model 707 airliners. The designation KC-135R covers USAF aircraft with similar airframe modifications but also new 22,000-lb (9,979-kg) thrust CFM International F108-CF-100 turbofans. Principal versions KC-135A (basic model), KC-135B (few aircraft with TF33-P-5 turbofans), KC-135E (updated AFR and ANG aircraft), KC-135R (updated USAF aircraft), and C-135FR (11 French aircraft updated from C-35F standard). Principal users France and USA. Technical data Type: Boeing KC-135A Stratotanker five-crew inflight refueling tanker. Engines: four 13,750-lb (6,237-kg) thrust Pratt & Whitney J57-P-59W turbojets. Performance: maximum speed 585 mph (941 km/h) at 30,000 ft (9,145 m); initial climb rate 1,290 ft (393 m) per minute; service ceiling 50,000 ft (15,240 m); radius 3,450 miles (5,552 km) to offload 24,000 lb (10,886 kg) of fuel. Weights: empty 106,306 lb (48,220 kg); maximum take-off 316,000 lb (143,338 kg). Dimensions: span 130 ft 10 in (39.88 m); length 134 ft 6 in (40.99 m); height 41 ft 8 in (12.69 m); wing area 2,433.0 sq ft (226.03 m^2). Payload: about 120,000 lb (54,532 kg) of fuel offloaded at a radius of 1,150 miles (1,850 km) or, in the secondary transport role, 160 troops or 83,000 lb (37,650 kg) of freight. Postscript: While observing and testing Air Tasking Order systems I learned that some KC-135 tankers can refuel from each other. This makes sense when a tanker in orbit has extra fuel beyond what is needed to RTB. The tanker replacement had to burn fuel to reach the orbit point. [TWC] - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2000 18:18:20 +0100 From: "David Linthwaite" Subject: RE: Fairchild Republic A-10 Thunderbolt II Interesting post. Never heard of the Northrop YA-9A though. Can anybody enlighten me ? - -----Original Message----- From: owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com [mailto:owner-skunk-works@netwrx1.com]On Behalf Of Terry W. Colvin Sent: 18 July 2000 20:05 To: tlc-brotherhood@NoPostage.com Subject: Fairchild Republic A-10 Thunderbolt II Competitive fly-off In 1967 the U.S. Air Force launched a program for a subsonic tactical support warplane able to carry a large warload in the primary anti-tank role. Prototypes were ordered from Fairchild Republic and Northrop, the former's YA-10A first flying in May 1972. The YA-10A was evaluated competitively against the YA-9A, and declared winner of the competition in 1973. Tank buster The Thunderbolt II was designed as a low-cost type, and therefore lacks all-weather capability and relies on the pilot's head-up display for accurate weapon delivery. Total production was 723 aircraft designed specifically to survive against Soviet battlefield air defenses and knock out Soviet armor. Survivability was provided by widely separated engines, a titanium armor bath for the pilot and primary systems. Offensive capability was provided by the GAU-8/A Avenger seven-barrel cannon firing depleted uranium projectiles, and a large load of varied ordnance (including six Maverick air-to-surface missiles) carried under the fuselage and wings. Despite the type's protective features and low-level agility, there are now serious doubts about the A-10A's survivability because of its very low speed and comparatively large size.** Principal version A-10A Thunderbolt II (sole production version). Principal user USA. Technical data Type: Fairchild Republic A-10A Thunderbolt II single-seat tactical support and anti-tank warplane. Engines: two 9,065-lb (4,111-kg) thrust General Electric TF-34-GE-100 turbofans. Performance: maximum speed 439 mph (706 km/h) at sea level; initial climb rate 6,000 ft (1,830 m) per minute; service ceiling not revealed; radius 288 miles (463 km) with a loiter of 1 hour 42 minutes. Weights: empty 24,960 lb (11,322 kg); maximum take-off 50,000 lb (22,680 kg). Dimensions: span 57 ft 6 in (17.53 m); length 53 ft 4 in (16.26 m); height 14 ft 8 in (4.47 m); wing area 506.0 sq ft (47.01 m^2). Armament: one 30-mm multi-barrel cannon and up to 16,000 lb (7,258 kg) of disposable stores. **Desert Storm postscript: This information card was written before the proven Warthog success in Desert Storm. The Iraqi armor, artillery, and support vehicles were devastated by A-10 firepower. The niggling question remains of how well the A-10 would do in an offensive mode against a better prepared enemy in the forests and plains of Europe or elsewhere. [TWC] - -- Terry W. Colvin, Sierra Vista, Arizona (USA) < fortean1@frontiernet.net > Home Page: < http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Stargate/8958/index.html > Sites: Fortean Times * Northwest Mysteries * Mystic's Cyberpage * TLCB * U.S. Message Text Formatting (USMTF) Program - ------------ Member: Thailand-Laos-Cambodia Brotherhood (TLCB) Mailing List TLCB Web Site: < http://www.tlc-brotherhood.org >[Allies, CIA/NSA, and Vietnam veterans welcome] Southeast Asia (SEA) service: Vietnam - Theater Telecommunications Center/HHC, 1st Aviation Brigade (Jan 71 - Aug 72) Thailand/Laos - Telecommunications Center/U.S. Army Support Thailand (USARSUPTHAI), Camp Samae San (Jan 73 - Aug 73) - Special Security/Strategic Communications - Thailand (STRATCOM - Thailand), Phu Mu (Pig Mountain) Signal Site (Aug 73 - Jan 74) ------------------------------ End of skunk-works-digest V9 #50 ******************************** To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe in the body of a message to "majordomo@netwrx1.com". 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