From: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com (skunk-works-digest) To: skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Subject: skunk-works-digest V10 #23 Reply-To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com Sender: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Errors-To: owner-skunk-works-digest@netwrx1.com Precedence: bulk skunk-works-digest Friday, June 29 2001 Volume 10 : Number 023 Index of this digest by subject: *************************************************** Re: SR-71A-1..... Re: SR-71A-1..... Re: SR-71A-1..... Re: SR-71A-1..... Re: "Dark Eagles" by Curtis Peebles SR-71 book Re: skunk-works-digest V10 #22 Re: YF-113G Re: YF-113G Re: YF-113G Ways to contact me CORRECTION #9 06/20/2001 F-117A Controls Re: F-117A Controls? RQ-4A - Global Hawk Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? *************************************************** ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 18:34:51 -0700 From: "Jon Price (PJ)" Subject: Re: SR-71A-1..... Damn! I was planning on putting mine on E-bay tonight! Oh well, snooze and you lose. Don't post this good news on R.A.M. for a week or so, OK? 8<) I'll post the URL to the Ebay page and see what happens. Guess I'll make it a worldwide auction. PJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: John Stone To: Skunk Works Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 05:12 Subject: SR-71A-1..... > Hello All, > > Just returned from Blackbird Association reunion, and news is Jim > Goodall will be republishing SR-71A-1, with additional 40 recently > declassified pages, it'll be $99 again (so hold off on those $500+ > eBay auction bids). And he will have a new SR "walk around" book > soon, later this year or early next. I saw proof on "walk around" > book and it's pretty cool! > > Later, > > John > -- > > John Stone > > http://www.blackbirds.net > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 19:54:52 -0700 From: "Jon Price (PJ)" Subject: Re: SR-71A-1..... For what its worth, heres the URL. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1439995087 I also have mint copies of both volumes of the "Lockheed SR-71 Supersonic/Hypersonic Researcher's Handbook that I will be putting on E-bay in the next week or so. Maybe my timing will be better on these! I'll post a URL. PJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Price (PJ) To: Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 18:34 Subject: Re: SR-71A-1..... > Damn! I was planning on putting mine on E-bay tonight! Oh well, snooze and > you lose. Don't post this good news on R.A.M. for a week or so, OK? 8<) > I'll post the URL to the Ebay page and see what happens. Guess I'll make it > a worldwide auction. > > PJ > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: John Stone > To: Skunk Works > Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 05:12 > Subject: SR-71A-1..... > > > > Hello All, > > > > Just returned from Blackbird Association reunion, and news is Jim > > Goodall will be republishing SR-71A-1, with additional 40 recently > > declassified pages, it'll be $99 again (so hold off on those $500+ > > eBay auction bids). And he will have a new SR "walk around" book > > soon, later this year or early next. I saw proof on "walk around" > > book and it's pretty cool! > > > > Later, > > > > John > > -- > > > > John Stone > > > > http://www.blackbirds.net > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 101 10:51:25 EDT From: keller@eos.ncsu.edu Subject: Re: SR-71A-1..... John Stone wrote: >Hello All, >Just returned from Blackbird Association reunion, and news is Jim >Goodall will be republishing SR-71A-1, with additional 40 recently >declassified pages, it'll be $99 again (so hold off on those $500+ >eBay auction bids). And he will have a new SR "walk around" book >soon, later this year or early next. I saw proof on "walk around" >book and it's pretty cool! Any word on what the 40 additional pages will cover? - --Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:21:20 -0500 From: "Albert H. Dobyns" Subject: Re: SR-71A-1..... John Stone wrote: > > Hello All, > > Just returned from Blackbird Association reunion, and news is Jim > Goodall will be republishing SR-71A-1, with additional 40 recently > declassified pages, it'll be $99 again (so hold off on those $500+ > eBay auction bids). And he will have a new SR "walk around" book > soon, later this year or early next. I saw proof on "walk around" > book and it's pretty cool! > > Later, > > John > -- > > John Stone > > http://www.blackbirds.net What are the chances of getting just the additional pages? Have you seen any of these pages? Al ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 23:25:15 +0200 From: Andreas Parsch Subject: Re: "Dark Eagles" by Curtis Peebles On Sunday, 17. June 2001 17:19, Gavin Payne wrote: > I've just finished reading Dark Eagles by Curtis Peebles. > I thought it was very interesting, although there's no way to prove > or disprove some of the things. > > Any comments? Hi, I actually like the book a lot. However, this is probably because I like Peebles' generally "skeptical" attitude - in the chapter about "Aurora" and other hypothetical aircraft, he doesn't try to sell too much speculation as hard facts. When discussing the various alleged "black" aircraft, he says the only really credible aircraft (of those reported by various "observers") is the "funny looking" stealth test plane, known sometimes as "SHAMU", probably built by Northrop. Peebles made this statement in the first edition, published before the revelation of the "TACIT BLUE". Whether it was luck or good research, I don't know, but so far he has hit the nail on the head. Again, I admit that I'm biased in favour of the book because I consider myself a "sceptic" like Peebles (if you are, too, you will also like his book "Watch the Skies!" - a history of the UFO phenomenon), so readers with no (or the opposite!) bias may not be as enthusiastic as I. Best wishes Andreas - -- US Military Aviation Designation Systems http://www.designation-systems.net/usmilav/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 18:09:51 -0400 From: "James P. Stevenson" Subject: SR-71 book The SR-71 flight manual will be available from Ross & Perry Publishers within the next 30 days. Jim Stevenson - -- Ross & Perry, Inc. Publishers 717 Second St., N.E., Suite 200 Washington, D.C. 20002 Telephone (202) 675-8300 Facsimile (202) 675-8400 JStevenson@RossPerry.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:14:47 -0700 (PDT) From: CFA3@webtv.net (C.F.A.3) Subject: Re: skunk-works-digest V10 #22 >From: "James P. Stevenson" > >Subject: Re: YF-113G >In a conversation I had with a an Air Force >general in charge of the F-117, he said the >MiG >designations were a continuation of the >century >series. Thus, the F-110 was the original Air >Force designation for the F-4, the F-111 was >for >the obvious, and then the F-112, 113, etc. >were >a continuation of the series but applied to the >MiGs until you got to the F-117. >Jim Stevenson >On 6/11/01 4:53 AM, "Andreas Parsch" > wrote: >Hello, >"YF-113" has been floating around for some >time as a designation for Soviet aircraft in the >USA, presumably MIG-23s (with YF-110 being >attributed to MiG-21s). Last year in April, >AW&ST printed a note, that YF-113G referred >to a secret stealth aircraft. This was denied >shortly after, stating that the designation did in >fact refer to MIG-23s tested by USAF. Now >we're told again that it's a secret US aircraft. I >wonder when the denial of this statement will >come up ... >act is, the public still doesn't know. >Sometimes, "well informed sources" say one >thing, sometimes they say another. While it is >certain that the USAF did/does indeed use >designations in the YF-11x range for secret >testing, there is apparently no definite >knowledge "in the open" about the actual >ypes >behind these numbers. >Best wishes >Andreas I learned this info last year: These are not my words, but from 2 email exchanges I had. I'm not trying to be a spook, here. I'm just trying to give the author some slack. Some of you may recognise him anyways. ************************************ The YF-113G was definitely a U.S. made prototype, and not a foreign type. I don't know which contractor built it. The squadron commander who made the first Air Force flight in the aircraft was assigned to that classified unit after 1991, and probably around 1993. His next assignment took him to the Naval War College in 1996. So, we know the YF-113G first flew in the early to mid 1990s, at Groom Lake, no doubt. & On a recent visit to North Base at Edwards, I had a chance to mingle with most of the command staff from Groom, including the base commander, and several squadron and group commanders. Also, the first USAF pilot to fly the YF-113G was there..... *************************************** What I seem to remember about THIS YF-113 was the "G" designation being of significance. I guess it allowed the program to mingle among the other YF-113's (MiG's) CFA3 http://community.webtv.net/CFA3/GROOMLAKEAUDUBON ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 00:40:06 EDT From: Xelex@aol.com Subject: Re: YF-113G Sometime between May 1994 and July 1996, an Air Force test pilot (whose name I have deleted here) "was handpicked as the first commander of a Classified Flight Test Squadron where he led a classified prototype aircraft" called the YF-113G "from design to first flight". It is further noted that "as a fighter pilot and experimental test pilot, he has accumulated over 2,900 flight hours in 54 aircraft types and was first Air Force pilot to fly the YF-113G, a classified prototype." Peter Merlin ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 11:49:42 +0200 From: Andreas Parsch Subject: Re: YF-113G Xelex@aol.com wrote: > > Sometime between May 1994 and July 1996, an Air Force test pilot (whose > name I have deleted here) "was handpicked as the first commander of a > Classified Flight Test Squadron where he led a classified prototype > aircraft" called the YF-113G "from design to first flight". It is further > noted that "as a fighter pilot and experimental test pilot, he has > accumulated over 2,900 flight hours in 54 aircraft types and was first Air > Force pilot to fly the YF-113G, a classified prototype." > > Peter Merlin Thank you (and CFA3 for his posting) very much for this insight - I think I can make some sense out of this "YF-113" issue now: - - "YF-113" without suffix (or suffix other than "G") = MIG-23 - - "YF-113G" = secret U.S. prototype (flown early or mid 1990s) BTW, as I understand it, the knowledge about the _existence_ (as opposed to any details) of the relatively new (less than 10 years old!) secret YF-113G aircraft program is apparently unclassified (otherwise you wouldn't talk about it, I assume). This surprises me a bit, when I see how the USAF does ridiculously avoid any public reference to an _air base_ near Groom Lake. I really wonder if there is any rationale about what kind of info gets declassified ... Best wishes Andreas - -- US Military Aviation Designation Systems http://www.designation-systems.net/usmilav/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 16:30:16 From: "wayne binkley" Subject: Re: YF-113G Found this searching Google. wayne Mysterious YF-113G Was Actually A MiG-23 Mikoyan MiG-23 "The U.S. Air Force's classified YF-113G aircraft was a MiG-23, not an early effort to explore radar-evading technologies, as reported last week. The existence of the aircraft was verified by one service official, but a second had mistakenly identified it as a U.S. stealth testbed that was abandoned by the early 1980s. The YF-113G designation was assigned to MiG-23s -- a fighter built in the Soviet bloc that NATO code-named ``Flogger`` -- flown clandestinely by two special projects units. The aircraft flew in the late 1970s along with ``a whole range of aircraft that have operated /on the Nellis test ranges/ for years,`` a senior Air Force official said. An air traffic controller at Nellis AFB, Nev., who retired in 1981, told Aviation Week & Space Technology that pilots from a squadron called the Red Hats operated Soviet-bloc aircraft with the designations, among others, of YF-110, YF-112 and YF-113 with various suffixes. During the 1970s and 1980s, numerical designations for captured or clandestinely obtained foreign aircraft and U.S. ``black`` projects were assigned numerical designations on a chronological basis by the Flight Records Group at Norton AFB, Calif., hence the F-117 stealth fighter and other classified, U.S.-built projects appears in the same sequence as re-designated Soviet aircraft. In fact, the Air Force sources say, there were two classified units flying Soviet equipment on the Nellis ranges. Tactical Air Command had the Red Eagles, who operated the aircraft for dissimilar combat and tactics development. The Red Hats flew the aircraft while conducting engineering analysis and technical exploitation of the aircraft for Air Force Systems Command. The units recruited some of the services most talented pilots and engineers, such as Lt. Gen. David McCloud, the late commander of Alaska Air Command, who flew with the Red Eagles. The units were disbanded after the end of the Cold War. The Soviet-built aircraft were primarily operated from the restricted Tonopah air base in the northwest corner of the Nevada range complex. Lt. Gen. Robert Bond, vice commander of Air Force Systems Command, died after ejecting near Tonopah from an ``Air Force specially modified test aircraft`` on April 26, 1984. It was thought to be a MiG-23." (source: AW&ST, April 16, 2000) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 12:24:49 -0500 From: George R. Kasica Subject: Ways to contact me CORRECTION #9 06/20/2001 Linda: Heres every way (currently) to contact us: VALID AS OF 1200 CST JUNE 20, 2001 George - ------ Business Phone: 262-677-0766 FAX: 206-374-6482 E-Mail: georgek@netwrx1.com Mailing Address: - ------------------ Netwrx Consulting Inc. George Kasica N165 W20901 Glencoe Lane Jackson WI 53037 If you can't find me one of these ways I'm probably road pizza....LOL George George, MR. Tibbs, Nazerene & The Beast Kasica(8/1/88-3/19/01) Waukesha, WI USA georgek@netwrx1.com http://www.netwrx1.com ICQ #12862186 Zz zZ |\ z _,,,---,,_ /,`.-'`' _ ;-;;,_ |,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'_' '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 10:09:12 -0700 From: David Lednicer Subject: F-117A Controls Last night, I went to our local AIAA dinner meeting and the speaker was Robert Loschke, a retired Skunk Works engineer, speaking on "The F-117A Flight Control System". He is an AIAA distinguished speaker, which means that he will be giving this talk to other AIAA chapters. If you get a chance, his talk is well worth attending. He goes into a lot of technical detail that is not present in any of the books that have been published on the aircraft. In fact, the level of detail he went into is amazing - I learned quite a bit. BTW - he, like I, recommends the AIAA case study on the F-117A design. His comment was that all other books are riddled with errors. If people are interested, I will write up details of what I remember him saying. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- David Lednicer | "Applied Computational Fluid Dynamics" Analytical Methods, Inc. | email: dave@amiwest.com 2133 152nd Ave NE | tel: (425) 643-9090 Redmond, WA 98052 USA | fax: (425) 746-1299 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2001 15:48:10 EDT From: SecretJet@aol.com Subject: Re: F-117A Controls? In a message dated 22/06/01 18:07:25 GMT Daylight Time, dave@amiwest.com writes: << If people are interested, I will write up details of what I remember him saying. >> Yes - PLEASE! - ---------------- Regards, Bill Turner, B-T 'Admin'. http://www.secretjet.net Black-Triangle E-Group HQ. Near London Heathrow, UK. http://members.aol.com/BlackTriangles/index.html - ----------------------------------------------------------------- No Door is Closed - To an Open Mind! - ----------------------------------------------------------------- http://members.aol.com/Secretjet/Links.html Black-Triangle Links ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:40:47 -0500 From: "Dave Bethke" Subject: RQ-4A - Global Hawk Unmanned spy plane flies into Langley HAMPTON -- The aircraft display at Langley Air Force Base, put on Thursday for visiting NATO ministers, represented the past half-century of U.S. Air Force combat might. But the feature attraction in a nearby hanger was a peek into the future, the sort of leap-forward technology advocated by the Bush administration. The RQ-4A, nicknamed Global Hawk, arrived at the Air Combat Command headquarters about 3:45 a.m. Thursday -- with no one aboard -- after a 10-hour flight from Edwards Air Force Base in California, via the Texas-Mexico border, Florida and up the Atlantic Coast. - --more-- http://www.pilotonline.com/military/ml0622dro.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 08:54:33 -0500 (CDT) From: Todd Madson Subject: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? This morning on my way to work, I took the 180 bus out of the Mall of America north to downtown. This passes the final approach for MSP just 1/2 a mile short of the runway and frequently I'll see some landing approaches very closely. Today I got the shock of my life when I saw an aircraft approach the runway...at first I thought "C-5 galaxy....no, too small. C-141? No....too small..." The thing kept getting bigger and bigger and lower and lower until I saw the light blue tail with the words ANTONOV in white letters that I knew surely what this aircraft was. It was an AN-124 or similar. Let's just say the manufacturer super-sized everything. At its closest, it was perhaps 100 feet in front of us and 50-80 feet from hitting the tarmac. It was gigantic. And loud too. It easily drowned out the bus motor.. Anyway, the first thought was: "what is an Antonov doing in Minneapolis?" The other thought was that they were allegedly bringing the spyplane back from China using one or two Antonovs. So was the plane brought here for diagnosis and disposition? What other reason could there be for one of these aircraft to be here in Minneapolis. Can anyone give me some plausible ideas on this? This was between 8:05-8:15 a.m. on 29Jun2001 (my birthday), so I'll not likely forget it. - -Todd - -- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 10:18:18 -0400 From: "Weigold, Greg" Subject: Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. - ------_=_NextPart_001_01C100A6.5C09BBFC Content-Type: text/plain Is there a Boeing plant near there? Or possibly one of the electronics manufacturers? Like Raytheon or something? If it was the EP3 coming in from China then I could see it going to various manufacturers like Boeing for work before or while being reassembled.... Thoughts?? Greg W Todd Madson 06/29/01 09:54 Please respond to skunk-works To: skunk-works@netwrx1.com@SMTP@BlytheExchange cc: Subject: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? This morning on my way to work, I took the 180 bus out of the Mall of America north to downtown. This passes the final approach for MSP just 1/2 a mile short of the runway and frequently I'll see some landing approaches very closely. Today I got the shock of my life when I saw an aircraft approach the runway...at first I thought "C-5 galaxy....no, too small. C-141? No....too small..." The thing kept getting bigger and bigger and lower and lower until I saw the light blue tail with the words ANTONOV in white letters that I knew surely what this aircraft was. It was an AN-124 or similar. Let's just say the manufacturer super-sized everything. At its closest, it was perhaps 100 feet in front of us and 50-80 feet from hitting the tarmac. It was gigantic. And loud too. It easily drowned out the bus motor.. Anyway, the first thought was: "what is an Antonov doing in Minneapolis?" The other thought was that they were allegedly bringing the spyplane back from China using one or two Antonovs. So was the plane brought here for diagnosis and disposition? What other reason could there be for one of these aircraft to be here in Minneapolis. Can anyone give me some plausible ideas on this? This was between 8:05-8:15 a.m. on 29Jun2001 (my birthday), so I'll not likely forget it. -Todd -- - ------_=_NextPart_001_01C100A6.5C09BBFC Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls?

          Is there a Boeing plant near = there?  Or possibly one of the electronics manufacturers? Like = Raytheon or something?

          If it was the EP3 coming in from China = then I could see it going to various manufacturers like Boeing for work = before or while being reassembled....

          Thoughts??

          Greg W





        Todd Madson <crash@waste.org>

        06/29/01 09:54
        Please respond to skunk-works
                =        =20

        To:     skunk-works@netwrx1.com@SMTP@BlytheExchange
        cc:    
        Subject:        = Antonov AN-124 in Mpls?

          This morning on my way to work, I took = the 180 bus out of the Mall of
          America north to downtown.  This = passes the final approach for MSP just
          1/2 a mile short of the runway and = frequently I'll see some landing
          approaches very closely.

          Today I got the shock of my life when = I saw an aircraft approach the
          runway...at first I thought "C-5 = galaxy....no, too small.  C-141?
          No....too small..."   = The thing kept getting bigger and bigger and
          lower and lower until I saw the light = blue tail with the words ANTONOV
          in white letters that I knew surely = what this aircraft was.  It was
          an AN-124 or similar.

          Let's just say the manufacturer = super-sized everything.  At its closest,
          it was perhaps 100 feet in front of = us and 50-80 feet from hitting the
          tarmac.  It was gigantic.  = And loud too.  It easily drowned out the bus
          motor..

          Anyway, the first thought was: = "what is an Antonov doing in Minneapolis?"
          The other thought was that they were = allegedly bringing the spyplane back
          from China using one or two = Antonovs.  So was the plane brought here for
          diagnosis and disposition?  What = other reason could there be for one of
          these aircraft to be here in = Minneapolis.

          Can anyone give me some plausible = ideas on this?

          This was between 8:05-8:15 a.m. on = 29Jun2001 (my birthday), so I'll not
          likely forget it.

          -Todd

          --





- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C100A6.5C09BBFC-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 10:24:05 -0400 From: John Szalay Subject: Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? Probably the same thing, they were here in Louisville Ky. Hauling some oversize cargo. We had them here ( I say, "Them" cause at several times during a 3 month period, there were 3 of them parked on the ramp at one time) Suprised the heck out of me, I walked down to the gate and saw 3 parked out at the freight ramp waiting to be loaded. The first time one landed here, it was flying in a flight sim for the UPS hub. something to train and test the UPS crews. Never did find out why the 3 month series of shuttle flights but it was interesting to watch. there was at least one on the ramp at anytime you looked. At 08:54 AM 6/29/01 -0500, you wrote: >This morning on my way to work, I took the 180 bus out of the Mall of >America north to downtown. This passes the final approach for MSP just >1/2 a mile short of the runway and frequently I'll see some landing >approaches very closely. > >Today I got the shock of my life when I saw an aircraft approach the >runway...at first I thought "C-5 galaxy....no, too small. C-141? >No....too small..." The thing kept getting bigger and bigger and >lower and lower until I saw the light blue tail with the words ANTONOV >in white letters that I knew surely what this aircraft was. It was >an AN-124 or similar. > >Let's just say the manufacturer super-sized everything. At its closest, >it was perhaps 100 feet in front of us and 50-80 feet from hitting the >tarmac. It was gigantic. And loud too. It easily drowned out the bus >motor.. > >Anyway, the first thought was: "what is an Antonov doing in Minneapolis?" >The other thought was that they were allegedly bringing the spyplane back >from China using one or two Antonovs. So was the plane brought here for >diagnosis and disposition? What other reason could there be for one of >these aircraft to be here in Minneapolis. > >Can anyone give me some plausible ideas on this? > >This was between 8:05-8:15 a.m. on 29Jun2001 (my birthday), so I'll not >likely forget it. > >-Todd > >-- > > > > \\ ~ ~ // ( @ @ ) -----------oOOo-(_)-oOOo---------- | john.szalay@att.net | ------------------Oooo.----------- .oooO ( ) ( ) ) / \ ( (_/ \_) I yam whaddIyam. No trees were harmed in the transmission of this message, However, A rather large number of electrons were temporarily inconvenienced. Friends, don't let friends do AOL! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 10:33:25 -0400 From: John Szalay Subject: Re: Antonov AN-124 in Mpls? At 10:18 AM 6/29/01 -0400, you wrote: > Or possibly one of the electronics manufacturers? Like Raytheon or >something? If it was the EP3 coming in from China then I could see it >going to various manufacturers like Boeing for work before or while being >reassembled.... Thoughts?? Greg W > > Minn has the Lumonics laser plant , if they were shipping a CNC laser or several overseas, it would be useful to send them that way, when we got ours, it came in two 18 wheelers. And FWIW: its too soon for the EP-3, they said it would take a month to get it ready to fly out, and its only been 2 weeks. I expect if they remove the wings and engines and tail, they would be going straight to the boneyard. the rest of the hulk with all the antennas and electronics ( whatever is left, that it.) would be going to the lockheed plant to be checked for bugs and reused if possible. I would think they wuld be used as spare parts or to fit out a new airframe. \\ ~ ~ // ( @ @ ) -----------oOOo-(_)-oOOo---------- | john.szalay@att.net | ------------------Oooo.----------- .oooO ( ) ( ) ) / \ ( (_/ \_) I yam whaddIyam. No trees were harmed in the transmission of this message, However, A rather large number of electrons were temporarily inconvenienced. Friends, don't let friends do AOL! ------------------------------ End of skunk-works-digest V10 #23 ********************************* To subscribe to skunk-works-digest, send the command: subscribe in the body of a message to "majordomo@netwrx1.com". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-skunk-works": subscribe local-skunk-works@your.domain.net To unsubscribe, send mail to the same address, with the command: unsubscribe in the body. Administrative requests, problems, and other non-list mail can be sent to georgek@netwrx1.com. A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "skunk-works-digest" in the commands above with "skunk-works". Back issues are available for viewing by a www interface located at: http://www.netwrx1.com/skunk-works/ If you have any questions or problems please contact me at: georgek@netwrx1.com Thanks, George R. Kasica Listowner